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Post by trappnman on Feb 4, 2008 19:07:18 GMT -6
I've caught quite a few wet bitches- more than a lot of people.
you can talk all you want about increased fight as the days wear on, but its falling on deaf ears because I just don't believe it.
now its 1-3 huh? didn't I just say 50 or so?
I sometimes wonder if you even read the posts before responding- if oyu wOULD read them, you might see that I not only never said this: but to say there isn't a better coyote tool than a 1.75 for year round/all weather, all season coyote trapping just makes NO logical sense.
but I said just the opposite.
yes, I guess if you or anyone can't catch and hold coyotes well in 1.75s, I am indeed better than them in using 1.75.
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Post by trappnman on Feb 4, 2008 19:09:17 GMT -6
Zags- if you were going to trap coon, rats, mink and beaver in a conibear- what would you choose? beav ain't saying its the best- but it is as close to an all around trap if you are looking for one as you could find.
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Feb 4, 2008 19:14:44 GMT -6
what does this mean then?
but as far as using thyme trapping for a living-
90% all the ADC coyotes I've taken, were in them.
100% of all my collared yotes- were in them.
would I go out on an ADC job of several hundred dollars with Duke 1.75 and feel confident in using them? Yes- many times.
The question would be why would you use them when there are better alternatives?
Tman I didn't say 1-3 total you need to read, your not going to tell me your taking 50 a summer on ADC work? Let if fall on your deaf ears the facts are the facts, if you where to read summer time trapping their and here isn't close to the same!
It is not the point do they hold! The point is the misses and over the long run your going to have more coyotes with a larger jaw spread per visit basis, the stock trap and the role it would play in ADC work and the abuse it does take on 3 day checks, this isn't an opinion I have seen traps many of them and many take abuse, the reason someone started to beef them up in the first place and I'm telling you these mods didn't come from a 24 hr check law fur trapper those are facts.
tman states he would have NO problem doing all his ADC work with them, I contend you would have problems and the adage I can get them the next time through doesn't hold water in ADC trapping work!
I can catch many animals in traps smaller by design, many have us have done this, but is that what we trully want to use by choice? People admit they are small and have draw backs then why use them if you don't have to by law? On 3 day checks who would want to use a stock 1.75? I can hold about anything that gets a paw in a victor 2 dbl longspring, but am I going to use them for coyote or beaver trapping when I have far better choices? NO
Experiance in fields of ADC work tells you the 1.75 is not a trap to be used or counted on as high a % of the time as larger more well built traps or they would be buying all Gov trappers 1.75's! They are far cheaper.
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Post by Zagman on Feb 4, 2008 19:15:34 GMT -6
Hey, let Beav speak for himself.......
I am stirring the pot, as I know he uses the 330 for beaver, not the 220. Which goes against his analogy of using an all-around trap for multiple species......
Will you please let me play my reindeer games....you go focus on TC38 and let me screw with Mr. Mathers..............sheesh.
Zagman
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Post by ColdSteel on Feb 4, 2008 19:26:37 GMT -6
Good debate here .Best all around conibear for everthing thats easy a 280
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Post by thebeav2 on Feb 4, 2008 19:32:28 GMT -6
Well lets See the original post was " 1.75 Dukes « Thread Started on Today at 7:39am » So Zag I don't know how your body grip scenario has any bearing on this post were talking foot holds. Now If you want to start a new thread about body grips I will answer your question. Stop trying to Hi jack this thread If you don't have anything constructive to add then just sit back and observe Old Buddy LOL
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Post by edge on Feb 4, 2008 19:54:56 GMT -6
**Will you please let me play my reindeer games....you go focus on TC38 and let me screw with Mr. Mathers..............sheesh.**
LMAo!!!!!
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Post by trappnman on Feb 4, 2008 20:01:52 GMT -6
what does this mean then?
but as far as using thyme trapping for a living-
90% all the ADC coyotes I've taken, were in them.
100% of all my collared yotes- were in them.
would I go out on an ADC job of several hundred dollars with Duke 1.75 and feel confident in using them? Yes- many times.
it means:
90% all the ADC coyotes I've taken, were in them
100% of all my collared yotes- were in them.
would I go out on an ADC job of several hundred dollars with Duke 1.75 and feel confident in using them? Yes- many times
seems self explanatory.
bototm line- YOU have no confidence in usng 1.75s- in fact, did you even try the doz someone sent you?
So if you aren't confident i nusing the trap- then don't use them.
But don't tell me I can't do what I do. SD coyotes, are no different than MN coytes of WY coyotes or KS coyotes once in a trap.
You seem to want to get into this numbers thing- how many TRAPPED coyotes last year? year before? etc?
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Post by trappnman on Feb 4, 2008 20:07:20 GMT -6
Zags..LOL
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timmy
Tenderfoot...
Posts: 23
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Post by timmy on Feb 4, 2008 21:35:41 GMT -6
ive seen small dogs break chains that could pull a truck, they didnt do it right off, took em a day or two
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Post by Freak( Jim V.) on Feb 4, 2008 21:56:13 GMT -6
Always been a big 1.75 duke fan and still am , but year after year I feel myself falling further and further in to the bigger stronger mentality. And it is for a reason.Today , i seen my first Bridger #2 with jaws popped out from a coyote. This was a modified trap, even took pics of it. On 6inches of chain or less. Chit happens out there , why settle for pullouts and mysterious empty traps?Since slowly and very grudgingly(is that a word?) switching to bigger stronger traps , my percentage of mysterious happenings is getting WAY low. just my view on this. I will still use my Duke 1.75s...............in Pa.
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Feb 4, 2008 22:37:37 GMT -6
The numbers are year round tman and we have been through this debate previous, you think by making a 5 day trip here and there that is what it is like 365 days a year, it is not and the coyotes look the same but don't act the same. Not meaning they are superior to any other coyotes, but they do react different in traps and they do shy way from areas that people would tend to see coyotes more often . I grew up in Iowa remember and I trapped coyotes there and those coyotes don't act like these do becuase of pressure applied from many ways you don't experiance where you are, do you debate this fact? Coyotes that are shot at from ranchers,callers,deer hunters, antleope hunters, ADC program work and many out of state shooters that while hunting p-dogs make it a combo hunt. The coyote is looked at differently from your state to mine and that equals into the pressure applied and makes for paranoid coyotes, beings your into OG"s quotes read his artical from trappers world awhile back on these factors that he and many others have seen take place more and more in the last years, mainly all related to more pressure applied. Until you have spent the time in areas of heavy pressured control areas and all other factors sorry I can't tell you what you have been missing when it comes to the fight of a coyote in the spring/summer and being pinned on the prairie. I have the pictures for proof and I can tell you a far different catch circle from a fall pup and even adults compaired to those raising young in the spring/ summer time. The numbers I could care less they mean you have healthy coyote population, here I run 50-60% mange and in a control area, I'm more than happy to set you up on ranches this fall and you can trap your hearts content and we will see what your take for 1 week or 2 is here compaired to SE Minn and bring those 1.75's along I can clean up after you leave LOL. I'm serious on the invite maybe then you might have a different outlook, then again maybe not. Calling it quits on this one same old, same old I'm sure most get sick of our bantering on this sunbject.
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Post by foxcatcher1 on Feb 4, 2008 23:10:52 GMT -6
I catch a load of coyotes in duke 1.75 every year. I would say 75% of my traps are 1.75 of those most of them are duke. I get very very few pull outs misses. Now I have not trapped out west and do very little ADC work but I strongly believe that once a coyote is caught it is there when I get there in the 1.75s. I don't like using the #3 or larger due to the fact that we get alot of non-target catches here. There is just no way anyone will convince me that 1.75 is not a good coyote trap I just catch too many each year to feel otherwise.
Don
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Post by edge on Feb 4, 2008 23:13:30 GMT -6
** I'm sure most get sick of our bantering on this sunbject. **
Not me.Watching you two parallel a subject nearly always agreeing on it,but unable to *realize* it,is really a good read.
And I am being totally serious.
Edge
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Post by trappnman on Feb 4, 2008 23:33:23 GMT -6
if the coyotes acted so absilutely different- and everyone else I talk to out there tends to agree with me viv a vis fighting a trap- and after you dared me to use 1.75s out west, and what I saw, I don't care what your opinion on the 1.75s is- you don't use them (or enough)so your opinion on them means no more than my opinion on using M-44s.
I've not seen ANY difference in the behavior of western coyotes vs Mn coyotes.
Why do you always state coyotes don't get harassed here? In many ways, since most coyotes here are in contact with people more often, they get harassed more. hunting seasons 6 months long, every farmer with a gun- seems like half of the coyotes I get have birdshot in them.
Your coyotes are no different than any other western type- which includes MN- where do you think ours came from?
A coyote in a trap is a coyote in a trap- and I've NEVER seen- yes, in only 31 yotes in 2 weeks of western trapping- but you'd think I'd see ONE of these super yotes. And being smaller than ours- I've seen them do NOTHING more than mine do here as far as fighting the trap.
If I could trap SD- I'd be more than happy to have a coyote competition with you. I'm very comfident in my skills, as I'm sure you are. But pretty cocky saying you'd clean up MY misses- don't be TOO surprised if I'd clean your clock. There- hows that for trash talk?
I've heard an awful lot over the years of what I can't do- and I just keep on doing it.
one other point- O'Gorman says he have very few LOSSES with 1.75s...think he's running 24? or even 48?
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Post by thebeav2 on Feb 4, 2008 23:41:04 GMT -6
Zag where are you
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Post by foxcatcher1 on Feb 4, 2008 23:48:28 GMT -6
Calm down Steve your gonna blow a gasket. ;D
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Post by Zagman on Feb 5, 2008 6:18:54 GMT -6
Beav, I am in Tampa FL, where are you?
Mr. Beav.....I believe my 220 analogy is spot-on relevant.....
You say the 1.75 is not the perfect coyote trap, but since you trap multiple species, it serves many purposes for you, which certainly makes sense. Plus, I beleive most of your coyote trapping is in the south, yes?, so the weather is not as much a factor.
If you know how to use the tool, more guiding, etc, then it works for you. Got it.....
Jump to the 220.....not the perfect beaver trap like the 1.75 isnt the perfect trap for coyotes, but in the proper hands, more guiding, it will kill every beaver that sticks his head in it.
So, I am wondering why you want to save money on your land traps and only use the 1,75 across the board, yet are willing to spend boo-koo bucks on separate piles of 220's and 330's, traps that are much more costly than land traps?
So, while not perfect for beaver, why aren't you using the 220 across the board for beaver?
Still in Tampa........81 degrees.
Zagman
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Feb 5, 2008 7:19:43 GMT -6
tman can you take some ribbing or not? Second your 31 coyotes where they on 72 hour checks yes or no?
As far as OG and your one liner quote: call and ask how many 1.75's he has set for coyotes in the last 20 years and please post the answer when you get it. Also while on the phone ask him what trap he relys on for over 30+ years of ADC work, I'm betting the 1.75 won't be even mentioned nor do I beleive he would recommend them if other traps are legal and available to use. I never stated you can't trap coyotes with those smaller traps, I'm stating they are not an ADC trap stock on extended checks nor are they a 365 day a year trap for maximum results compaired to others available. You stated you have used them and would have zero problem using them as your ADC trap in any area at any time with no loss in efficantcy correct? my contension is they would cost you some coyotes and they would look alot different than your accustomed too on your shorter checks 365 days a year.
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Post by trappnman on Feb 5, 2008 7:33:12 GMT -6
tman can you take some ribbing or not?[
sure I can- can you point out where you were trying to be funny?
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