|
Post by Stef on Jun 2, 2010 19:49:30 GMT -6
yeah, especially on short chain and during freezing weather My nose catch is cleaner than yours coonduke but still a hell of a catch... Congrats!
|
|
|
Post by Stef on Jun 2, 2010 21:14:55 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by ohiyotee on Jun 3, 2010 11:20:02 GMT -6
toe catches is where they shine if you ask me , the tendons and bones are in tack and that makes the differance
|
|
|
Post by Stef on Jun 3, 2010 11:49:22 GMT -6
I agree, especially if the jaws are thick
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 3, 2010 13:56:10 GMT -6
Scott K wrote: quick question:why does the topic of "toe catches" come up in this conversation, when a offset is discussed.As i thought that the reason for a offset was for live market and/or foot conditions.A good percentage of "toe caught" animals experience some foot damage.The wider the offset the more foot movement can be obtained. No, not with the proper offset designed for the intended targets offsets keep the foot from having tears and breaks. So toe catches are better in a good well designed offset trap! You don't get foot movement because of an offset, again you can power up and increase jaw width with the offset and you get little to any movement of the foot from even the largest coyotes or hardest fighters. Here is a 2 toe rear foot catch held it perfect in a sterling trap, again proper desgn and power are keys to it all.
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 3, 2010 17:12:35 GMT -6
Flat set as are 80% of my sets.
|
|
|
Post by scott kimball on Jun 3, 2010 18:32:36 GMT -6
No, not with the proper offset designed for the intended targets offsets keep the foot from having tears and breaks. So toe catches are better in a good well designed offset trap! TC39; that statement turned a few lights on. Scott
|
|
|
Post by MRussell on Jun 3, 2010 20:50:58 GMT -6
Hey Zag I looked at your setup and you have long chains and shock adsorbers. You also have laminated traps. The lams and shocks will hold a toe caught yote. I agree with steve about the offsets. I am not convinced that they give me that much of an advantage. I base plate and laminate all of my coyote traps. I do not four coil them anymore, it is unneccessary for where I live and trap at. I do not need the added power. Rarely does it freeze up and we are required to run a 24 hour checks. I could not see where offsets really helped me with non targets(coons) either.
|
|
|
Post by MRussell on Jun 3, 2010 21:05:36 GMT -6
Coyotes can be scared of what we have left behind.Creeping or crawling is only a new revelation to us because we never see them do it.A full pad catch is a result of comfort or reckless abandon.IMHO
|
|
|
Post by tomsnare on Jun 3, 2010 21:25:24 GMT -6
The trap I use is offset and when the animal isn't pulling on the trap it relaxes some of the pressure on the animals foot ,so the offset is critical to the way this trap functions and it will hold about anything that steps in it so far --------Tom
|
|
|
Post by monttrap04 on Jun 3, 2010 21:41:07 GMT -6
Lots of good info in this thread guys. Thanks for sharing. I got to thinking about lugged offsets to make my rj bridgers 5/16" offset. One of the main criticisms about lugging is that it prevents the levers from riding up to maximum height. As a fix I have heard of folks modifying the leverls. I decided to do a little grinding on the outside of the jaw so I went out in the shop tonight and made one up with a modification to the jaw. Here are some pics. 1/4" smooth rod welded just below the lamination with rough edges filed down. I had to file a little on the bottom of the lug to get the offset to the desired 5/16". This offcourse left the levers substantially below where they should be for a good lock up. So I took the grinder and ground out a flat spot between where it should lock up and where it was hanging up. Took just a few seconds per jaw. I was pretty happy with the results. The trap on the left is a stock bridger #2. The trap on the right is the modified ones. The only thing that I don't like about the lugs is that anything caught on the side of the jaw gets pinched. Anyone have any critiques on this type of modification. I only made up one and am definately all ears.
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 4, 2010 6:08:45 GMT -6
1080 what you don't see in this picture is the trail which is just off the left side of this set, the coyote was using this trail fall calving and have issue with them chasing. To the right and below this coyote is a side draw that leads down to a creek bottom lined with some trees and badland clay banks. Yeh I know open and no back stop on this set, but I use the slight rise and some guiding there . A small punch hole with a tiny bit of lure and used the wind to blow the smell to the coyote,very well blended in set. I have found this type of set to be very good when they find it with their nose and not their eyes at times, plus draws little attention from the cattle most of the time. The problem with using the side draw with the buckbrush is the only cover for porkys and rabbits which showed sign of both using that cover as well.
I'm guessing you would set the stand out feature on the hill top? The lone tree? The problem with that is cattle like it too plenty of fresh sign up there from cows. So I set next to the trail and kept the set camoed well. A t-bone or rock backing would have attracted cows so went this way.
Fire away!!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 4, 2010 7:32:57 GMT -6
first of all, I think that we all agree, that offsets aid in toe catches. I can't read where anyone, said any different- which leaves us with the question do small (small as to width) offsets do any good OTHER than toe catches?
To TCs picture- the only things visible, other than flat pasture, is two small rises, and that lone tree-
I know 1080 adhors travel routes per se. So, what is he looking at?
I DO know, that coyotes will, given the opportunity, travel and stall out, on higher ground-
close? not even close?
|
|
|
Post by 17HMR on Jun 4, 2010 8:26:03 GMT -6
In TCs pic, I like to set near the telephone poles where the trails or two tracks cross if the cattle are not there rubbing on them. but the way he has described the area we cant see, he is on target, as the proof is in the pic.
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 4, 2010 12:32:54 GMT -6
This trail is the preffered route most of the time as durring the summer this pasture is vacant and is much taller with mixed prairie grasses and sweet clover, until he hays it off and gets it ready for a winter pasture the 2 track is the only moad of travel for the coyotes. They use this 2 track as behind that hill is the creek area. They come down it to the East as the creek offers excellent denning locations and his sheep are in the summer pasture down this road 3/4 to 1 mile. They get used to traveling this trail as the rest would be like walking thru a jungle. The poles in the back ground have zero trails by them, the lone tree is cattle hang out when they are here in the winter, as the water is just up and over the hill. The B is this 2 track that goes off frame to the upper left to where he is supplament feeding on a daily basis. The lower right has the buck brush draw leading back down to the creek area what he was using for bedding in. I would have just called him in and been done, but the ranchers boy works them over pretty good with the call and randy anderson videos . I always use the wind when setting any trap as many of my sets are non visable and like to use a well belended set. It attracts less non targets all the way around, plus I have found it to be adventagous to allow them the odor with no visable feature, at times you create the milling effect with this approach IMO. This trail has been the demise for many coyotes on this ranch. Snares agreat in the summer when you have barriors of vegitation, but not so great come late fall with cow/calves using this pasture. I picked this location as the tracks showed me he was comming right by and over to the feeding area of the cattle. The buck brush offered an avenue of approach and then down the back side of the hill to the creek and a little north to his layup spots. North is the direction the coyote is facing here. Is it the best location? WHo knows but I set on sign and yes I could have made another set type by drilling in a dirthole into the bank at a 90 but my cow interest would have increased. So I went with a stake hole at a 90 with a few drops of my favorite lure! So he was traveling to the cattle on this trail and in the summer the opposite direction to the sheep on the same trails, this area I work alot and pickup coyotes as they sift up and down the drainage behind that large hill year round. In doing so I feel, very well blended sets and changing lures up annually I keep my catch rate very high on this producer. Hard to be nervous of the ground as it appears and odors wafting about. Here we see a spring pair that where working on new born lambs which are over the hill straight down this new freash field edge. A in this photo is lower left the denning location and the trail along the field edge is the travel way to the sheep B being the sheep, 2 well blended sets and playing the wind produced this double the rancher came by to plant and found them and did them in. Here is a more typical feature type sets the large protrusion that screams set me LOL. Yet one more of those, set here you dummy locations LOL. Love the big round rock!
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 5, 2010 8:30:28 GMT -6
I set where the coyotes are traveling or the stand out feature. I set flat ground if that is where I need to, but on the side hills there are trails and most of them don't go up and over the top the shortest route from A-B . Slim P called it the 3/4 quarter spot in many locations and using my well blended set types I use the wind alot to bring those coyotes to a set. The picture of the coyote by the yuacca for example the trail is right below him you can make it out.The wind direction is the north, right behind the coyote and yucca, same with the outstanding rock pile north is directly behind the rocks. I like a backing for sure if present. If not I make use of guiding and make the trap pan the best place to put a foot. Stall out milling areas are good and give you multiples and a key location for future use no doubt, and you can help enhance these stall out spots to, I'm sure your well aware of that. I believe most coyotes are going to catch the scent cone on the outer edges and then work in from there, so setting on the uprise and using the wind I find little problems with snapped traps or the such. Plus making the trap the best place to step on first inspection of any set type.
I can make a flat area for the trap to sit if needed and use well blended walk thru types alot of the times, well bedded, subtle guiding and rock solid traps.
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 5, 2010 20:10:17 GMT -6
Yes spring/summer easier to pin point but I find calling my first go to tool, as that can end killing very quickly, then traps/ snares. Alot less wondering fure sure!!! Water is a key element and also locating can give you clues on dry ground with little tracking, heck even looking at a fresh kill can tell you what direction at times they come from. Summer time I'm looking for those straight line tracks telling me the travel to and from the den.
Summer time/ hot weather sage brush lowlands and draws with water close by. Early fall pup trapping in sept and october still finds those family groups in close proximity and gang setting works fine and dandy. in the same general area.
As far as the 3/4 zone and areas where one finds coyotes in the winter at least here is the same place you will find bobcats and visa versa. After our major deer hunting season, those coyotes are laying down in the thicket stuff or out in the middle of no where in a hidy hole, the same place that holds prey base and seclusion. Big baits and snares are my main deal then, some foot trapping but snares really shine for me when the weather gets bad.
|
|
|
Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 6, 2010 8:55:53 GMT -6
NE SD has some great coyote densitys,more than here in the western part. The Hills has alot of coyotes as well. Here we are on a rebound from 7 years of 50-60% mange and in a few locals 60-70% mange. The last 3 winters have been tough on those mangy ones and has made for excellent aerial hunting for sure!
The plane has it's place for sure as we cover alot of area and many producers. In some areas though the plane is of little help cedar canyons, heavy and high vegitation can be a problem for effective aerial hunting etc,etc.
WE had 7 years of bad drought very dry and 90%+ of all dams dried up, so bad many ranchers where spending alot of money for water wells to keep livestock and many where hauling water by truck and tank daily, many cut their herd sizes back alot, then 2 years ago the rains came and things starting to get back to more normal.
AC heck my last truck had a CD player in it!!!!!! LOL.
Wiley has some old plat maps of the bait stations placed in this country and the numbers taken and notes from one of our retired guys, very intersting reading for sure! The amount of time and effort for the control of predators was very good! Down falls are in todays world would never fly a few pets taking part would have it done and over with in short order.
|
|
|
Post by thebeav2 on Jun 6, 2010 17:30:50 GMT -6
I may be way off base here but I would think that a lighter pan tension would result In more toe catches.
|
|
|
Post by scott kimball on Jun 6, 2010 18:09:25 GMT -6
Bev; In theory it does seem this way. I use zero pan tension and get very few each year.I believe ( Along with others ) If the animal likes what you offer them then they commit them selves to stepping down on the pan with full force.
Scott
|
|