DP lesson

[rionueces]

I got lazy and tied this dp trap off to a tree. After 4 coons in a row tied off to the tree, the 5th one found a way to leverage the trap and pull out. I moved the trap 2 feet with an earth anchor and continued to catch coons every night for another 3 days.,....

BTW there was not any difference in the catch rates between Dukes and Daggers.

[trappincoyotes39]

BTW there was not any difference in the catch rates between Dukes and Daggers.

I found the opposite to be true push/pull versus just pull. 2 totally different triggers.

Yep swiveling is key to any good anchored trap. The pogos worked awsome on the DP's pre rigged super fast and worked great!

[trappnman]

without that side branch, and "loose wired" meaning not cinched down tight around the sapling, it would be a perfect anchor for coon, and one I use a lot. gives him 360 around the tree, and up and down.

[trappincoyotes39]

Tman in a DP I don't want anything the coon can get leverage against and you don't have to worry about chewing so I would" pogo" it in the open and give him no solid pull and guranteed swiveling. For DP's that is.

Those daggers pre set and rigged with cable and the pogo is one lighting fast setup!

[rionueces]

The loose wire set up is quick and easy. Thanks for the tip.....

[motrapperjohn]

Got a call from someone doing some video for me and he has go one on tape getting caught reaching up grabing the spring and using his both back feet on the front of the tube and compressing the spring and releasing his foot!!!!!!!! No chit! I was laughing my but off, cant wait to get that CD. He has got some other footage that will change to way you think about DPs.
Another dont with Dps is have entaglement within reach where they can get a wrap or 2 around something, I should say that goes for any trap.
If you are using a large bait, or completly covering the trigger you wont notice much difference. Had one guy tell me he was filling the tube half way full with catfood.

[GoBlueGuy]

I have been using Duke DP's for a few months. Motrapperjohn is correct. Do not place them where a coon can get any leverage be it on a tree, log, or even high grass. When care is taken with location I have not had any coon pull outs. I also have not had any fired traps from coon or possum fooling around with the dog. I bait with a large marshmellow under the trigger and then about 1/2 inch of cat food over the trigger and 2 or 3 mini marshmellows on top of the cat food. A little squirt of some coon juice or some type of lure like Blackies Night Bandit and I am ready to move on. I don't fill the trap up because I don't want the coon to get bored if that is possible. I want him to get to the trigger and see the large marshmellow under the trigger as fast as he can. It has been working very well for me.

[trappincoyotes39]

go blue buy a few daggers and you won't have to fill them or have a marshmellow under the trigger, for they reach down and wacko their sits the coon, can't get bored with that trigger and push/pull design. Telling everyone, the few bucks more the daggers well worth it!

[mustelameister]

Jan 4, 2012 19:42:10 GMT -6 motrapperjohn said:

Got a call from someone doing some video for me and he has go one on tape getting caught reaching up grabing the spring and using his both back feet on the front of the tube and compressing the spring and releasing his foot!!!!!!!!

OT, but precisely why I don't use center-swiveled foothold traps for 'coon when targeting the front foot.

[trappnman]

is have entaglement within reach where they can get a wrap or 2 around something, I should say that goes for any trap.


I agree- but not for "pullouts"- and certainly not for "can't use entanglement because they pull out"

stepping on levers is one thing- or binding a dp so the spring opens- but if you have coon "PULLING OUT OF TRAPS"-

GET NEW TRAPS!

if a coon can "pull out of a trap' it either has a minisule hold, or its a poor trap.

[motrapperjohn]

They are not going to pull out of a Dagger Unless there is entanglement or as I described before. Anyone who has tested them side by side with caught coon can tel the difference. Had one of the girls swinging from the Dagger and pulled out of the Griz with not a whole lot of effort. Just the difference in the opening. PInching verses wedging.

[trappnman]

entanglement per se, should not allow a coon to pull out of a coon trap- and from what you say, I doubt if its occurring under what I mean by pullouts in your traps-

and thats a coon that is pulling straight against the trap, pulling out by sheer strength.

entanglemnt is ok, IF its nto permanent-

think of it like a dog o na chain- if he can go around the tree 5 times- hes tied up and tangled- same as a coon-

but if hes only allowed to go 3/4s into entangment (ie the tree) the only option is to come back around.

so entanglement the way I'm talking, isn't binding up the trap/chain/swivels- its allowing a coon into and out of brush and cover.

[trappincoyotes39]

entanglement has zero benefit with a DP.....................

[trappnman]

does it?

why?

entanglement, meaning as I defined it, reduces fighting the trap considerably- those that stay away from "entanglement" simply have no idea, how much it DOES reduce fighting the trap-

and anytime an animal is more comfortable, and fights the trap less- thats good in my book.

[trappincoyotes39]

because to me entanglement can go from a small positive into a larger negative really quick, the word entanglement not good in my book. Dp's take care of most reasons why one would use entangelment on coons in the first place. Great swiveling takes care of the rest.

[thebeav2]

In most coon trapping situations entanglement can lead to the traps losing their swiveling action and that Isn't a good thing. This Is even more serious when using foot holds.

[RdFx]

39 , trappnman has a valid point as you do, you are both right! In the end it evens out!

[trappnman]

could not agree more- and perhaps I should say setting in cover where a coon has access to movement, yet doesn't foul the swivels or bind the chain-

and while thats not true entanglement I guess if you mean tangling up to the point of inactivity.

but allowing a coon movement, via either the use of drags or loose wiring, you allow the coon to get into cover........... if moveable drags like beanches, I can tell you from hundredso f coon on such drags, true entanglement happens so little, as to not even be a factor nor a consideration. I can count on one hand, with fingers left over, how many coon I've had take a drag, and entangle the chain/trap/coon. its a constant tangle, untangle- might sound like it doesn't work, but it does. and on small creeks, on 24 hour checks, you cannot beat a branch type drag, for one reason- it 100% preserves the set. and on small streams, using branches almost always leaves the coon well within sight of the set location, often within 10-20 feet.

with loose wiring, take my dog on chain example to heart- its entanglement, but entanglement that only goes to a certian point- like a snare with a deer stop on it- so the coon can go so far, but cannot complete the entanglement and MUSR reverse- and endlessly repeats the pattern.

The coon bmps show what happens with no cover, no "entanglement"- something any canine trapper that catches more than a couple coon, can attest.

don't knock it, until you have tried it.............

[trappincoyotes39]

Tman I'm talking DP's mainly. Doesn't matter what the set proper looks like after the catch smooth it out bang in the dagger, bait and go and you will catch coon after coon until they are all caught up. The DP's are an above ground tool so no bedding issues or remake issues with them. To that point a dagger with a pogo anchor and j hook in the open works very well and most of those coons are held for less than 12 hrs. I get swiveling at the trap at the anchor and around 360 with the cable,j hook.

The coon BMP's also show that entanglement to the point of loosing all trap rotation ends up with some very bad scores as well...... DP's have made a fast improvement when it comes to coon BMP"s and testing a coon trap for coons that really limit a majority of damage. Now if we loose swiveling on them, well we lost alot of that advantage of the design of the trap.

[trappnman]

Really? show me the breakdown on entanglement situations with coon bmps-

cause i missed the allowing of certain types of entanglement

lets not miss the forest here because the trees got in the way-

and lets not wrap all the side issues into one ball, and then try to debate that-

One advantage drags have, is keeping the set location clean.

they have other advantages as well, but the main one, perhaps, is it keeps the set area clean, allows you to use the orignal set most times without reluring or rebaiting.

the only thing drags have in common with loose wire sets- is they allow far, far more movement than staked sets- and they also allow a coon to get into cover-

and any coon in cover, fights a trap less than staked solid (as the coon bmps, with their LACK of protection cover points out quite plainly in that NO single jaw foothold trap "passed".

many if not most would have if "entanglement and allowing movement, was utilized.

thats not opinion that stone cold FACT- I don't put very much credence into someones opinion on it thats never tried it, thats never used it.

so- anyone that has tried "entanglement" knows that a coon fights a trap far, far less, if at all (the trap itself) -

yo utelling me that now with dps- coon wlefare is now a moot point to you?

sure- no foot chewing- but you STILL get the biting, broken teeth, etc- big no nos with footholds, but apaprenlty, according to TC, no longer a concern now that dps are the law of the bmps.

so to me, having a bmp posterchild argue against comfort and animla welfare, is absurd.

but whats not absurd, is this- I pointed out a cure, for the problem that occurred in THIS thread-

loose wire- you won't get the binding that leads to lost coon, and overhead and side cover, reduces/eliminates much of a coon's adverse reactions to being held.

if you don't wanna, don't-