Jack Mackerel ?

[thebeav2]

If you trapped my marsh and you let me set the huts and you set the feed beds you would look the fool when you came out of the marsh on the first check. Feed beds toilets Non existent. And I'm serious as a heart attack.


Man made pull outs:

Problems.

What happens If It rains.
NO evidence of a pull out the whole hut Is wet. Lure Is still working.

What about a light snow, how about a frost? I could go on and on about man made pull outs. If you want a man made pull out to work you need to make It obvious to that rat no matter what the conditions. Wet hand slap Isn't going to cut It.

On your challenge to 39 lets use two similar banks and see If lure out perform unlured sets. That's the only fair way to do the test. You dig your resting spots on one barren side and "39" sets lured sets on the other side. Now we have fair challenge. I know who will win this one.
It's like putting 5 unlured post sets on one side of the road and 5 lured sets on the other side. I'll take that bet too.

[mustelameister]

This is great stuff!!

[thebeav2]

Mike you can jump In anytime you feel frogy.

[trappnman]

beav- am still interested, in the methods of your OWN testing-

I know what my tests show-

[thorsmightyhammer]

Sept 20, 2011 5:08:16 GMT -6 RdFx said:

As a seven year old without anyone helping me when i set rat traps i used cut apples, potatoes, anything white to catch rats. Didnt have money for lure and did very well. This was during fall trapping. Under ice now i use a piece of white plastic on body grip triggers, works great....so one has to assume the color white means food to a rat....like this past weekend was showing students in trappers ed if they didnt have lure or white cut bait a grass with white roots showing does great in drawing rats to thier sets...... and thier skinning rats for put up showed it works.... now spring time when trapping spring bvr i catch alot of incidental rats with just popple sticks cut showing the white underneath.....so one can assume to some extent white color does attract rats...

Lee define what "great" means for underwater baited sets.

I havent found anything yet that is satisfactory. Maybe I am spoiled because we can trap in the houses.

I mean when you guys are making your baited underice sets whats your percentages?

On the aspen sets for the beaver in the spring its not the white, its the popple.

IMHO popple is as good as a bait for rats as anything. Maybe the best. Problem with it is it attracts beaver lol.


Beav, are ya having fun lol.

Whats the home range of a pond rat?

[trappincoyotes39]

home range of a pond rat? The size of the pond LOL.

[thorsmightyhammer]

Let me clarify a pond in my eyes randy.

I dont mean a puddle in the back forty. Lets say a 10 20 acre pond.

[mustelameister]

Sept 20, 2011 14:55:58 GMT -6 @thebeav2 said:

Mike you can jump In anytime you feel frogy.

Well . . . this is interesting, I'll say that for sure.

I've taken to carrying a tube of mint flavored toothpaste with me when 'rat trapping, and give those feedbeds an inch or so tube of that good smelling white stuff in the back of it. But I've never used "lure" as such on a hut.

Toilets I never lure either.

I do use lure on 'rat floats. Dip a Q-tip in and set it in the point of the V-shaped floats I use in current. I believe that helps draw 'em in.

But never on the huts.

I read here gang setting of 5-6 traps per hut. Maximum number of traps I set on a hut is usually four. Usually hit 3 or 4 'rats the first night, 2 the second night and pull the cold ones, then 1 or 2 the third night and pull what's left.

That's on huts where I can't set #110s in runs. If I've got good runs I might set only 2 or 3 traps on the hut. Now this year with colony traps I'm not sure if/how that's going to change.

The average hut I trap has one major slide and one or two secondary slides, or pullouts. So there are two or three traps. It's easy enough to smush in a little resting spot on the side of a hut (no, I ain't molesting the hut) and set a trap there. This "fresh" activity has, IMO, always drawn a 'rat that swam by. How do I know if my %s would increase if lure was used? Not sure.

I feel by the time I've left a hut that I've cropped most the 'rats out of it with the methods I use. If they are deep huts I'll come back out in winter and set through the ice for those migratory 'rats that came out of the "wayback" shallows after getting frozen out.

Now creek and small river 'rat trapping I like to dig out a "resting spot" and add a Q-tip to the roof of that with a little lure. Makes me feel better. These are drowners and I find everything in there from 'coon to mink to 'rats to beaver front foot caught.

So . . . who wants to take some time out of their trapping season and run a fair sampling? Not me. But it would be interesting. Alternate huts in a typical marsh . . one hut with lure the next without and just see if it makes a difference. Or one section of a 'rat marsh with lure and the next without.

I've always felt 'rat trapping was a "gimme" and 'coon trapping was enhanced by use of lure.

I also wonder what 'rats think when they approach lure on a hut where the first 'rat is out of the picture and they have the opportunity to really work the lure. Will they approach that lure again? Or aren't they that smart? I would believe they would approach a fresh "smush" on the side of a hut, or again approach a slide to bring up fresh material.

An interesting read for sure.

[RdFx]

On the under ice sets near rat huts and hopefully close to runways so rats can see white strip on body grips where rats havent been trapped out i would say i get three rats for every five traps in the initial setting and checking. On the popple , yes rats like that and chew the bark and inner bark off....... i have put just white peeled sticks and still rats come.... so color has something to do with it...the white on popple fades quickly but on maple sticks it stays white-white much longer

[Rally Hess]

ChrisM,
I didn't have any trouble finding the Jack mac keral in the dollar stores out in SD. It was cheaper there than at Wal-Mart in Huron. Only problem was they never had more than about ten cans on the shelf.

Anybody else had luck catching mink on rat houses in the "right" locations. I've always had real good luck catching mink(usually males) on the side of a rat house closest to the bank, especially when that house was the closest in a series of houses or on a point. I set it the first day I'm in, and rarely have a rat trap in place more than 4 days. I tend to move 25% of what I have set daily or move around a marsh or up or down the river. Alot of the houses have the shear side like Beav described, and make a pretty good location for a pocket, baited with a fresh rat.
My thinking being that a coon or mink traveling that bank with check out that closest house to the bank first, where my set is at. It seems to cut down on the number of mink chewed rats I have since I started doing this several years ago.
Steve,
Like you I'm not a big lure user for rats, but this last spring in SD, I used lure alot. It was common to set in a location one day and come back the next to have several people set up around me. I was the only one that was adding vegetation to my floats and added a shot of either Spearmint, peppermint, or anise to a pint of mineral oil. I caught my share amongst them, often with theirs not full. I'm not sure if it was the vegetation or the lure, but I caught some additional coons with the sweet stuff. LOL

[ChrisM]

Thanks Rally, others have suggested the Dollar deals too. I'll check there.

[trappnman]

The range of a pond rat, or any rat is how far he needs to go between food and his den/house during normal times. And thats not going to be very far from the food source.

evgerything eats rats in, on and above the water- he keeps to the edges or cover and he keeps travelling disatance to a minimum.

all, of course in my opinion based on what I see afield.

[trappnman]

mike-

I believe you are referring to-

I gang set every house as well- on good active ones, as many as 5-6. I got the same results, with unlured sets.


that was a rare occurance- on those "mega houses" one sometimes sees. standard was as you, 3-4.

[trappnman]

Now creek and small river 'rat trapping I like to dig out a "resting spot" and add a Q-tip to the roof of that with a little lure. Makes me feel better. These are drowners and I find everything in there from 'coon to mink to 'rats to beaver front foot caught.


mike, trust me on this- if only wanting mink and rats, the cutout is enough. I also have taken beaver, otter, coon from the set- and if the incidentals are important (for me they are to be avoided, becasue of situational water, etc) then you bet lure.

but just rats- that resting spot is enough without the lure. You aren't running those type sets run and gun I'm assuming, more on your longer riverline?

if so- take a chance, and set up w/o lure for the first couple of checks, then switch to lure.

Thats an example I've played out over and over- and it always told me the same thing.

beav- I'm truly curious as to what methods you used to compare lure/no lure success rates.

[thebeav2]

if so- take a chance, and set up w/o lure for the first couple of checks, then switch to lure.
Why don't you do that when your coyote trapping.

That In my opinion Is a poor test. Use both lured and unlured sets in the same area and see which ones produce . That Is the only scientific way to test anything. But then Mike already knew that.

The same On the rat house. Make 3 lured sets on one side and 3 unlured sets on the other side and see what sets preform the best. Any way that's how made my tests.

If your only placing 2 or 3 sets on a hut It's because you don't own enough traps. I GANG set the marsh. Next day check One more check on the second day. Then let them soak for two checks. Then Pull after that. Checking 3 days In row Is just wasted time. On the days those traps are soaking I'm setting up the second marsh. Then I get one check then I'm off pulling the first marsh.

With that many traps on a hut you can afford to leave them for the two days since there will be enough traps that are still In operation to take any left over rats.

[thorsmightyhammer]

Sept 21, 2011 8:41:30 GMT -6 trappnman said:

The range of a pond rat, or any rat is how far he needs to go between food and his den/house during normal times. And thats not going to be very far from the food source.

evgerything eats rats in, on and above the water- he keeps to the edges or cover and he keeps travelling disatance to a minimum.

all, of course in my opinion based on what I see afield.

Up in the pothole country up here you'll see rats swimming around quite a bit in the open water in late fall when it cool. Say late october.

If i pull up to a pot hole to set traps say before 10 am and I dont see any rats swimming around its not a good sign.

I've watched hundreds and hundreds of rats swim along the edges or out in the open for 200 300 yards, like they are out for a cruise or something.

The big ones move around quite a bit imho

[TRay]

With the current price of rats, I think the question should be would using lure have a chance of reducing ones catch. If not then why wouldn't you use it, one extra rat a day would pay for the bottle of lure.

In many of my areas there can be several other guys trapping the same rats I am, I would hate to be the only one not using lure as I am looking for anything to give me a little edge. Could I catch rats without it absolutely, but in running 300+ rat sets a day I believe that I can catch 1% more with lure then I am money ahead.

Several years ago when setting houses on a large marsh I was putting 4 traps per house a luring all 4, with about 10 houses left I broke the cap on my squirt bottle and lost poured all by lure in the water, with only a few houses left I decided to just set them instead of going back to the truck to get more lure. The next day when checking I went from a 3-4 rat per house average an the lured ones to 2-3 on the unlured houses. The thing that caught my attention is that on the 30+ houses that I checked every trap was fired (every trap was visited), on the last 10 houses most had at least one unfired (unvisited) and some 2 traps.

One thing I also have seen on houses is when I would make my indention into the side of the house to place a trap that if no lure was present many times the trap would be snapped with housing material. This was something that for me is not as common when I place a lured set. My belief is that the rats see the hole, indention and immediately try and fix it with material that end up getting stuck in the trap. With lure I believe they are more likely to investigate the smell before they decide to fix the spot.

[thebeav2]

One thing I also have seen on houses is when I would make my indention into the side of the house to place a trap that if no lure was present many times the trap would be snapped with housing material. This was something that for me is not as common when I place a lured set. My belief is that the rats see the hole, indention and immediately try and fix it with material that end up getting stuck in the trap. With lure I believe they are more likely to investigate the smell before they decide to fix the spot.

Now there's a man that has experience trapping rats In marshes.

[mustelameister]

Very interesting discussion.

I'm headed out on a camping trip through the weekend. You boys play good so I can come back and get smartened up here without it getting all deleted.

[trappnman]

why not use lure?

#1- IT DOESN'T MATTER EITHER WAY ON RATS-

#2- IT DOES MATTER ON COON, AND I DON'T WANT COON IN MY MINK/RAT SETS.

I'll gladly take rats in my coon sets, but DO NOT, based on how I RUN MY WINTER LINES want coon in my rat/mink sets. I'll TAKE COON, in MY COON SETS.

seems like both mike and myself, have as much "experience" as anyone trapping rats- and we both, say we never use lure on houses. Again, if you feel lure gives you more rats, then for sure use it. I have no doubt, that if using lure gives you confidence, then it surely will give you more rats.

Tray, you say w/o lure you get 2-3 rats per house per check, and with 3-4. Seems like a wash to me. In either case, you would spend 2 days most likely at each house, perhaps 3, and what you don't catch the first check, you will on the second.

and again, I personally, in many many years of living on some of the best rat marshes outside SD, seen where lure does me anymore, than without lure. and again, I'm not saying this lightly- i'm saying it with extensive testing back and forth.

and I'll personally contiune to state, based on years of testing and experience, that, for me, lure doesn't give me more OR quicker rats.

-----------------------

beav, if you truly don't understand the difference in coyote behavior and rat behavior, then thats the way it is.

I however, do understand, their habits, nature and actions are day and night.

as is their reactions to lure, and what lure does for such.