Steve, Resting set question

[trappnman]

like an ole dog with a bone- I can't let it go......

and just for the record, this isn't a debate on if baited pockets are better mink catchers- its a debate on blind sets, and a particular type of blind set.

spin it? I said IF you meant that, I disagreed. Since you didn't mean it that way, then I don't disagree.

now- somehow you got the notion, that fast water is the key, or even needed- and thats not so. If I've given that impression, let me clearly state that fast water, has nothing to do with the set concept.

I mentioned, current, or fast water only in that was one of the possible points to look for or create resting type sets. And I'm not talking FAST water, cause I agree with you, most mink would skip such- I'm talking about current, where it hits a bank. a change in degree, that gives the water a "bump", and many times you will have a vertical type eroded bank. where that current hits that bank, in lets call it MOVING water. at that point- a point where a rat/mink is coming down the moving water and in effect letting the water do the work- so that they as well, "hit" the bank at the X where current meets bank. a ledge or depression put there is indeed a hot set.

so fast water, isn't important overall, or in specific as the above type location.

lets look at it another way-

a good blind set minker, when coming to a likely looking stretch of creek, has the exact opposite problem of "looking all over" and that is, he sees blind sets everywhere.

but we know from experience, that all such are not equal. so at a glance, much of the stream can be eliminated down to an area, or areas where experience tells him, a traveling mink will most likely travel.

the minker now goes to his chosen spot, and looks and sees , still, multiple locations for blind sets- so he sets up the most likely of them. Its why the advice set a lot of traps and wait.

Which I do. A lot.

Why? because a traveling mink, does NOT take the same routes every time through. He WILL gravitate toward the same area(s), which are the possible locations you have set up.

Set em all up.

---------------------------------

lets go back to my example, of following mink tracks on small creeks in snow on creeks where there is a good population of mink. Tracks show, they randomly travel stream banks, cut across meadows. Many places show a mink track or two going into the water, but here and there, MOST of the tracks eventually go to key locations.

Almost always, hunting locations. Grassy banks, deep pools, etc.

Look at that location.

Why or more importantly, what, is that mink doing there?

by knowing that mink DO pause at certain types of areas(and keep in mind I'm not talking resting because of physical need/exhaustion- I'm talking the NATURE of a mink) because they HAVE to- its simply their nature when hunting.

In fact, a more concise way of stating it, it's PART of their hunting routine. They are going to do it- they are going to stop, look around- whether for food, predators I don't know, I'm guessing either or.

so by understand that, by knowing what they are doing at that particular location, one can look for such spots- they exist far more than one suspects BUT IN MANY CASES ARE NOT WHAT YOU WOULD THINK

they aren't escape spots, or holing up spots, or under bank hunting areas, or grassy runs- they are "nothing" spots- think of WB's description of his depression set.

They aren't magic bullets, but they ARE, again in my experience and my opinion, a higher success rate blind set, than having a bunch scattered around under banks, etc.

the debate over pocket type or nomenclature isn't important- whats important, is one simple thing- that, for me, its easier to predict where a mink will pause or "rest" than it is to predict exactly where he will be hunting, or traveling.

[mattduncan]

what i'd like to know is how far does a mink travel , i mean if like this area here you had a 1 1/4 mile square block and a waterway running through it does he evre leave the block , does he live in half of it , i'm sure it depends on prey but , lets say there is a pool with enough food for 3 weeks does he stay or not

[seldom]

Sept 24, 2011 21:07:40 GMT -6 mattduncan said:

what i'd like to know is how far does a mink travel , i mean if like this area here you had a 1 1/4 mile square block and a waterway running through it does he evre leave the block , does he live in half of it , i'm sure it depends on prey but , lets say there is a pool with enough food for 3 weeks does he stay or not

You might search out the "Habitat Suitability Indexing for Mink" study. It might give you some insight as to answering your question.

[trappnman]

thanks for the link seldom-

mink habitat/range study

some good stuff in it, including-

The home ranges of mink tend to approximate the shape of the water body
along which they live (Gerell 1970; Linn and Birks 1981). A mink's use of its
home range varies in intensity due to varying prey availability. During daily
activity periods, mink move back and forth in a restricted "core area," which
typically does not exceed 300 m in shoreline length (Gerell 1970). Eventually,
the mink will use another den within the home range as a base and will
intensively forage within an associated core area. Linn and Birks (1981)
found that the mink's home range in England typically contained one or two
core areas that were associated with prey concentrations. Although core areas
generally occupied a small proportion (mean = 9.3%) of the home range area,
mink spent approximately 50% of their time within these areas (Birks and Linn
1982). When prey was abundant throughout the home range, the core areas were
not as well defined. When the aquatic aspect of the habitat was nonlinear
(e.g., marshes), the home range was smaller and iess i inear in shape.

[calvin]

This only makes sense but I have to wonder (or assume) time of year (here up north anyhow) plays a BIG role in how far they travel. One really needs to know when and where this study was done. Mink food in April is far different (and more abundant) than say in December.

I was turkey hunting years ago sitting on the edge of a small river (Zumbro....upstream of you, Steve) and noticed a mink less than 6 feet from me on the outer edge of the river (calm deep pocket). I was AMAZED at how long it took her to find her food once he dove down into the pool. It was only a few (meaning less than 10...and most times less that 5) seconds before she surfaced with another critter. Down and right back up with a minnow, then back down and right back up with a crayfish, then again and again with other critters. They gorge themselves and couldn't believe she could eat that much. Kept coming up to the same spot on the bank right underneath me to eat so I could see exactly what she caught.

Now, this was spring turkey season so she didn't have to move AT ALL up or down the stream. That may be a different scenario in Nov/Dec as I assume those food holes (buffets) dry up.

I also go back in my head from when I had ferrets. They seem identical to a mink to me, even though domestic. They still hunt for things even if not hungry...and have been domestic for centuries. They programmed this way. Very very nosy and into any crack or crevice that may normally hold some type of food in the wild world even though they have never had to hunt ever.

If you ever get a chance to play with someones domestic ferret, take it. Also, lay down and let it walk on you. Many will go right out to the trap shed and lighten the pan tension on their mink traps.

[trappnman]

now thats an interesting observation Calvin- esp when talking about a deep pool. For those that don't know, the Zumbro is one of the few canoe-able rivers around here- so a deep pool would be of good size...............

and before I forget- come on some of you lurkers- get involved - this is turning out to be a darn good mink thread...........

so that mink hunting that deep pool,was, even granting she was a terrific hunter, feeding where food was quickly and easily available. To be honest, I didn't realize they were that efficient. hunters but of course it would depend on time of year.

but it brings into question, the concept of mink always being on the prowl for food.

I've been of the belief, that mink gorge and rest. not like canines, since they don;t have the fat buildup- yet, some of those males in Jan and Feb, are quite heavily covered in fat and it makes fleshing a bit harder...... but gorge on big meals, staying close for a few days, then holing up nearby for a spell.

if you read the study, you will read mink have core areas with denning sites close by, and they will rotate between core areas, meaning both plentiful food, and plentiful habitat. So- it seems all parts of the stream, are not equal.

A couple of comments Calvin- first of all, one year I went almost exclusively to 1.75s for my water trapping. rats and coon no problems, but at the end of the season, when the final observations were in, I felt strongly, I had missed mink because of their use.

and yes, I have used bigger traps for rats/mink- but those were "wore out " traps I didn;'t want any longer for land, and with the weak tension, worked just fine.

but these 1.75s had a crisp drop, no setting on hair trigger possible and even though they had a mink sized pan, I think mink just walked over the top of them, more than i knew.

Not to say I don't catch mink every year in baited coon sets in 1.75s, because I do- but there I'm not trying to catch mink on most of the sets, being pipes, so the trap placement is costing me mink...

but thats what the resting sets are for......

back to your mink Calvin-

I find it interesting that on a big pool, that mink returned to the same spot, each time. I would be very interested, in having you describe that location.

[thorsmightyhammer]

New 1.75's have too much pan tension IMHO.

For a flat out mink trap its pretty tough to beat a pinch pan.

[kelly]

I have seen two videos on the internet of feeding mink. In both instances the mink always went into the water and came out to the same position. One was on a large water and other a small pool below a culvert. The latter went in/came out on the same log laying in the pool. This mink caught numerous(3-4) small fish and was rarely in the water for more than a couple seconds. Unfortunately, have never been able to find that video again.

The other I have saved to my photobucket account so will post it here.

[kelly]

In real life have seen several mink "fishing" and everyone doesn't take long to find some food. The mink in the above video and one I've seen did not eat their catch but stashed them for later. So am not sure that "all" mink gorge. Realize that mink rarely have much fast on them but attribute that more to their high metabalism than being hungry.

[calvin]

Steve, Trying to recall the river exactly at that time. Up from you so it is smaller up there. Was spring so higher than normal water levels and don't remember really being a hole type deal like we have now in low water...just a lazy outside bend that appeared to be deep. The water wasn't moving very fast, however. I do remember that. The bank was vertical for the most part but had some small exposed roots on it with a little green grass and a couple small trees on the high bank. I remember her eating a frog a minnow and a crayfish in particular...all in a row and in short order. Took her only a couple seconds each to catch them.

As for holing up I think it would be determined by metabolism (and she may have had young at that time). As far as metabolism, I don't know what a mink's is but I remember seeing an animal show on Water Shrews. Stated matter of factually that the Water Shrew MUST eat every 30 minutes or they starve. Hows that for having to plan your day? Hey honey...I have to go run an errand...ooops times up, I/m dead. Crap. So, I think how that relates to the mink. I don't know a time frame, really, but they seem like they always on the hunt. Maybe for good reason. I don't know.

Metabolism and fat stores would determine how long they can hole up for. And like many animals this can change to some degree by time of year.

49er...Pinch pans. Just finishing up the last of mine tonight. Will be on every 1.5 mink/rat trap I set from now on if I can help it.

Neat video, Kelly.

[lumberjack]

Was near one of my old trapping bridges so I pulled over to check it out. I walked to the up stream end and peared over the side when just that second an adult buck mink walks out, followed nose to tail by another buck mink. I was probably 10-12 feet above them.
They disappeared into the grassy hummocks and all of a sudden came out into the water playing, wrestling and doing the alligator roll clenched ahold of each other almost otter-like.
They swam underwater following each other and anywhere there was a slot between rocks they were compelled to swim through.
There was heavy limestone rip-rap on the other side and they kept swimming through a certain hole and ending up on the bank I guess through a tunnel leading there.
Get this- while they were playing on the rip-rap a female comes up the bank from under the bridge and it was a stand off. The 2 bucks stared her down while she looked at them, and quickly departed back the way she came. Another little mink comes out from the grassy side, swam up through the rock tunnel never to be seen by me again.
This was on a hot July day with low water levels and I watched them for a good 10 minutes. I have watched wild mink countless times but they were always solo and for seconds, not minutes. I would have gave a left nut for a video camera that day.

[trappnman]

I've seen a fair whack of moving mink, but only a couple of times have I seen a feeding/hunting mink. and those times, one was feeding on a deer carcass, and one was feeding on a 6-7" trout and when it left, it just left

so it absolutely blows me away that the consensus of sightings, shows mink to be a very efficient hunter.... at least on water.

that explains so much that I have observed, and thought- or rather and more apt- it reinforces the WHY.

when I was taking gorging Kelly, I meant I guess large food sources. I've seen where they hang out and feed on deer carcasses for many days, and have often seen where they are 2-3 nights at a rat kill that they can't haul off.


speaking of rat kills- my success rate on them, is 100% if the mink returns. and I based that on if anymore is eaten.

years ago, I'd wire or stake it down when I found a partially eaten rat. Set 1 sometimes 2 traps- and its harder than it might seem, to get that mink w/o a rat tail or something in the traps(s)

at a guess, I was taking 3 out of 4, or 3 out of 5 or some such with setting 1 trap, sometimes 2.

so a few years ago, I was pulling next day, and had big mink tracks at a eaten rat- so had one chance- so set 4 traps around that staked down rat.

Next morning, I had that mink (in 1 trap if wondering, most times with this method it is in one trap) by chance, the next couple of kills, I had extra traps so set multiple ones at the location- and next check, the mink was here-

now, I do it on every kill- I'll pull 2-3 close by traps, if I have none handy, just for that 1 check- and with 3,4 traps at the set, you just do not miss that mink.

I find that on my creeks, in winter, that the kill is almost always, if half or more left, revisited that night.......... and by making it literally impossible to reach that rat w/o hitting a trap, hes almost always there the next check.

I've never had a snapped trap, or an eaten on rat after traps were set like that- happens to me 7-8 times a year, and if they come back, they are mine.

[trappnman]

pinch pans are on all my longspring mink traps for the most part- and I have no problem with them.

but why do you steven and others feel thay are the best mink pan?

I like that you can "hair trigger" them, but are the mechanics any different from a non night latched bolt-on pan & trigger, that is adjusted for 100% free fall?

[kelly]

Steve;

The pinch pans these guys are talking about are the square 2"x2" one like on the old square pan(many call them pinch pans) Victor 1.5 coil. They are installing them on 1.5 coils with bolt/nut setup to get a larger pan.

Regarding gorging I've seen the same on deer carcasses. Seems we have a buck of creeps around here who think the creeks are dumping grounds for their deer. And the mink really like the red meat deer provides so have seen them hole up by these carcasses for a long time. At least till I find it. That said, sometimes it takes awhile to entice them into my trap if there isn't any good location, ie deep water, nearby but usually after 2-4 days I've got them. Even gorging on deer meat with an unlimited supply my big chunk of carp always gets them.

[kelly]

How are you guys doing for water this year? We are very dry with many of my creeks with no or very little water in them. Unless we get a lot of rain in the next month it is going to be very hard to find drowning water in most of my good mink creeks.

[trappnman]

oh, ok Kelly- I thought they were talking the old pinch pans like on 1.5s, etc.

anyone kept any records of larger pans vs stock pans?

I've never used the larger pans, and the reason why is simple- I've never thought that using them, would give you enough extra mink to make it worth doing- that the distance between a stock pan and the trap jaw edge, was small enough that it would be a rare mink indeed to miss it. I could see where a larger pan would give you less tension, the furthre away from the trigger- but enough less ot matter?

maybe so- any other commensts ocncerning such/

I talked to my son in law yesterday, and he said the marshes were very low, which surprised me, as its only been a month or less since the river has gone down.

the Zumbro, a bigger river looks low, but all the secondary streams by me are spring fed so flucuate very little no matter what time of year.

[Computerhater]

Like an ole dog, you can't remember anything either. LOL 3 to 4 traps to catch a mink that ate your rat? This is the 4th time I've mentioned this to you over the years and you've liked the idea every time. Dig a hole in the bank (pocket set) and stuff the remains of the rat back in the hole. Reset your trap in front of the hole like any normal pocket set and if the mink returns you will catch him. And they do return about 95% of the time and they are there "resting" in my trap when I return..

Don't feel too bad Steve, I can't remember what I did yesterday. LOL

[trappnman]

I DO remember you telling me that.............NOW LOL

[thebeav2]

Isn't that the way every one does It.

[thorsmightyhammer]

I personally dont use pinch pans because of the increased kill area.

Its nice but probably the least reason why I like em.

I also dont worry about "hair" trigger. All I care about is if my pan is somewhat level. I prefer it if the pan travels a bit before it goes off.