|
Post by trappnman on Jun 9, 2016 19:24:23 GMT -6
When I was lucky enough to have a pig dump (and oh my what an attraction that was!) and could see it on a on a daily basis, I'd see rotting pigs dragged, and dismembered, and ate with a lot of such each day. To think that 10 drops of lure would spook a coyote, is absurd to my mind- so when someone says that.....I need to wonder why?
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 9, 2016 13:45:21 GMT -6
I've always said, paraphrasing ChrisM- "if it works for you, then you are doing it right"
but at the same time, when you have 2 trains of thought- one from a group that lives eats and breathes coyotes, and compare that to another group that doesn't................
a good example is the group that swears you cannot catch a coyote over a high backing- and I read this and see this said in videos and then repeated as if fact........
and my experience shows just the opposite
or those that state, seriously, that 4-5 drops of lure is all you can use, and that using more "spooks" a coyote, and it takes time (4-7 days is often given) for a set to "cool off" so that, apparently a coyotes tender nose can handle the scent.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 9, 2016 13:07:20 GMT -6
boy, lots there that goes against my experience
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 9, 2016 11:08:02 GMT -6
thanks! I had a copy but long lost I'd guess-
everyone should read this
but his advice on urine use- is FOX related.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 9, 2016 6:15:28 GMT -6
Bill out in PA has a flyer made by Russ Carmin I believe, talking about urine. In it, the case is made tat the modern thinking of "light, yellow " urine is the cream of the crop, and what all fresh, good urine looks like. When just te opposite is true- the dark, thick urine is actually the best urine-
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 8, 2016 20:00:54 GMT -6
1080 said once: " the old timers were right" regarding urine use
but you are right, most do not use it as I do. How you use it is how most do. I think that is based on fox trapping.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 8, 2016 16:54:55 GMT -6
Seldom- was hoping you would elaborate on the deep stepdown vis a vis fox- as I said, I most likely don't have enough to tell
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 8, 2016 10:57:25 GMT -6
on flat sets and dirtholes my trap is relatively close to the hole- so fox are no problem. grays are very rare in my 2 counties- over last 10-12 years have caught 4, and none for 7-8 years. back in the 80s, I'd catch 50/50 reds and grays.
I find just the opposite Seldom- that the deep stepdown is very good on reds- insofar what my low population of reds can show me. So it might just be that, not enough to really know either way. Most Reds I've ever caught was 35, and that maybe 10 years ago ((my wife is right, as I get older, time all blends together as to what happened what year). but I've never felt it to be a detriment to reds- but again, almost always set in sod, so if not committing hard to tell. on the other hand, I've never felt fox were very much set shy, meaning they don't have those same behaviors as coyotes
good to see a few guys jumping in- the more the merrier
to open a can of worms- I feel if there is a silver bullet to a set- the icing on the cake, I think it's urine use
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 8, 2016 8:00:23 GMT -6
if a lie is repeated often enough, and loud enough, it becomes fact to some.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 8, 2016 7:35:30 GMT -6
yes, that is exactly what I do.
I started spraying remakes decades ago, and always had good success at remakes. then out of desperation many years ago, started doing it on all sets (when I experimented with dips). I later read O'G does the same on rusty traps to minimize the odor of fresh rust.
When I went back to waxing, I continued using urine liberally at remakes, and off and on at new sets. Over time, and for many years now, I spray/mist all my sets, new or remakes with urine- over the pattern, where I was kneeling, and overspray the pattern into the surrounding area- I use a lot of urine!
1080 once said, and I agree, that the old timers didn't use urine as a lure, they used it liberally as a "cover" scent
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 7, 2016 9:00:37 GMT -6
true (re: fishing lures) but what I found is if I wanted to try a new lure (floating rapalas on stream trout for example) I did so by using nothing but until I learned it.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 7, 2016 7:18:26 GMT -6
many years ago, I bought Ron's book on fox trapping- and a set they used was a very similar triangular shaped stepdown. In areas that I thought looked "real foxy" I'd put in a deep stepdown. And I caught fox. But I also caught coyotes- and a fair amount of coyotes vis a vis the number of sets put out. To where the light went on, and I realized that it was a pretty decent set, and I should be making more of them. And I did- lots and lots of them. And at conventions, talking to new coyote trappers, I'd draw out the set-
and the next year, or by phone, they would tell me that they caught their first coyotes, or that they went from 2-3 to 10-15.
Marty is right about snow- but at the same time, my extended 2 months of a snow line of 2 years ago, taught me a lot about snow, and one thing it taught me is if you have snow and wind, there is pretty much nothing you can do. Any backing, any depression, and hole is going to be covered with blowing snow....I'm convinced if I used a match stick as a backing and a pin sized hole, I'd have a foot of packed snow over it in the morning.
So I don't find the stepdown to be too much more of a problem in snow than any hole set.
I think the set works for multiple reasons- while it is certainly not natural in design, I'm not sure if a coyote sees any difference than any hole in the ground- but if he does, the fact that it is by itself, with absolutely nothing else around eases his neophobic reactions. and lots of good smells coming from it?
I do it like this:
I cut the sod out of a triangle in the ground with a shape of roughly 12" side x 12" side x 10" base, with the lure hole going in at the point, just under the sod and at least 8-10" deep.
I toss sod (I sometimes place a bit over the hole as a focal point)to side, and dig out dirt to 5-6". Trap gets bedded tight into corner (I do right side for no reason) so it is below and level with the depth of cut out. Entire pattern is sifted level, a small clod/rock/corn cob, etc is placed next to the outer jaw by dog (I put dog out to left). 2 lures and bait go into hole, urine sprayed over entire set, and out of patter some as well.
I still make them in bare ground areas, such as near compost areas where there is often just short grass ground, or hardpacked
Why don't I make more? A couple of reasons- they are a little more effort to make, I like sets into backing now (as previous post)and I do think that stepdowns can take (since there is no long range visual) a bit longer to connect if not set on "the spot".
but really, I don't know why- I guess it is just the progression of a trapper, I made 2 I thinkflat sets last year- both connected- u sed to make 90% of more- ebb and flows I guess.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 6, 2016 18:58:39 GMT -6
seldom- just really noticed your placement of your stake-
why so?
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 6, 2016 18:57:30 GMT -6
I concur on Miranda's book and the effectiveness of his walkthrough, which he learned from Odon Corr. Had an interesting talk one year with Odon- he knows coyotes.
I do think that the effectiveness and success rate of a deep,in my case triangular shaped stepdown, is related to 4 things:
1) to be absolutely isolated- I use it primarily on bare ground, no cover, no backing no nothing but a hole in the ground that is the stepdown
2) the lure hole needs to be deep, and horizontal- just under the sod- in remakes I need to cut a piece of sod to recover the lure hole
3) multiple scents- I believe in this for all sets, but if at any time a set demands such, its here.
4) spray area with urine
1st set I taught Lori, and it took real convincing to get her to try other sets, because she had so much success with it.
I tell new coyote trappers that the stepdown is perfect as they learn, because it eliminates the 2 most common concerns in coyote trapping- blending & guiding
both are automatic in a deep stepdown.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 4, 2016 8:06:24 GMT -6
I'm trying to find pictures, I have way too many, and absolutely no organization. here is one from 2007- I like a similar set, but have larger patterns now. its a horizontal hole, dug under the sod here is same set, circa 2015 here is a very typical set location given similar circumstances. bare fields all around except for this tree belt and this larger patch of scrub woods/weeds
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 3, 2016 7:33:16 GMT -6
I for one, for multiple reasons, will be trapping this fall. esp coyotes. Two main reasons for it- 1) it took me a long time to build up permissions. if I trapped all or mostly public land, I'd not worry about it, but I know how permissions go- you don't show up for a year or two, and they tend to fade away. 2) I just enjoy the hell out of coyote trapping. I guess there is a 3rd reason as well- unless the market totally collapses (and despite the hand wringing fur) good fur still has value.
so trapping smarter becomes even more paramount.
and that leads me back to my quest to find the perfect set. I'm convinced that it IS a dirthole (to catch the most in the shortest time), but what makes that dirthole the best it can be?
I'm also convinced that a couple of things can be taken as a given- big patterns, deep holes, good backings.
and I am also convinced for personal use that multiple scents and liberal use of urine is key as well.
I know a lot of people don't want to post pics of sets- as they either fear copycats, or derision- but perhaps we can get a discussion going on what nuances we do to our dirtholes that set them apart, and provide maximum success.
If some others chime in, i'll share my "secret set"/....................
time to start shaking the cobwebs off, and think about fall
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on Jun 1, 2016 7:30:02 GMT -6
I think you would be great doing so
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on May 31, 2016 6:11:27 GMT -6
do you do other carvings- dark house decoys, etc?
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on May 30, 2016 6:30:52 GMT -6
don't know if you get up north that far, but I'll have all of Marty's stuff at the UP convention in July.
|
|
|
Post by trappnman on May 30, 2016 6:29:56 GMT -6
what type of other work like this do you do?
if you guys think this is good looking in photos, seeing some of these traps live is amazing
|
|