Furbuyers revisited

[Woodswalker]

Bryce you analyze a hobby trapper's catch of a dozen coon the same as if it were a million dollar dairy farm LOL. (Just kidding a bit.)

[bobwendt]

bryce, won`t that green fur rot in 6 months? lol. tad more labor investment there that just got overlooked like it was invisible. you know, like the invisible 40g truck that the visible gas goes in. beav, "groany made me do it" ya, probably was groanys fault. I think he ruined my live market too just so I had to sell him my coyotes, lol. I`m trying to figure whast is going to do with all those live coyotes?

[lumberjack]

I THINK THE HOBBY TRAPPER WITH A HANDFULL OF FURS GETS TREATED BETTER AT THE LOCAL BUYERS. Sorry about the caps
The kid that has 4 coon gets A whopper price which, I think, does 2 things;
It gets him to come back (the old bait and switch), and creates some cheap advertising.
If they cut a guy a buck or two that has 500-1000 furs, thats some quick money made fast.

[trappnman]

jole-

saw this sign once "We screw the next guy, and pass the savings on to you" in a bike shop...


sadly, this seems to be SAOP for some...

I want my buyer to be fair- to pay what the fur is worth- no more, no less--- no matter who is doing the sellng.

[Woodswalker]

The buyer has the trump card because he has the money. He can always do other things with the money than buy fur, but what else can the trapper do with fur but sell?

[mostinterestingmanintheworld]

You want what it's worth but the buyer has to predict what it will be worth in the future. And pay interest on the money in the meantime.

It's his job to make the best deal possible, same as yours.

The definition of what something is worth is what a buyer will take and what a seller will pay, and that is only for that split second in time.

Watch the stock market ticker, prices change every second.

One of my biggest challenges in counseling Real Estate clients is to help them understand that the price of their house can and will change from day to day.

Joel

[bobwendt]

I have an offer on a piece of farm ground right now. it`s a sliding offer, it is open ended ( no time limit)and drops $100 an acre a week. I plainly said my life left to enjoy the land gets shorter as time pases, so with every week the land is less valuable to me. I`m tired of dricking around with these guys that think there is gold on that land, so I left it up to them how cheap they want it to go before it is zero to me and I move on to other parcels of interest and they are left sitting with their thumb up their nose and empty handed .

[Steve Gappa]

You want what it's worth but the buyer has to predict what it will be worth in the future.

Joel- you are missing the point- I DON'T CARE overall what prices are offered- I'll sell to a buyer that I know from exprience is givng me his top offer.

What I do find distasteful- is the SAME coon, being bought depending on who is holding it- THATS bogus.

what live coyotes or low prices or any of the red herrings offered have to do with this, is beyond me.

[bobwendt]

the price of live coyotes or red herrings does change pending who is selling. some are known for better goods than others, and some just deserve more, or less, as the case may be, because they are regular customers or not, or maybe just difficult folks that take up a lot of time and cause problems.

[mostinterestingmanintheworld]

I remember when I was a little kid I took 8 rats to L. Bloom and sons in Ogden Utah. I got like 80 cents for mine.

Mom was waiting in the car but I hid behind the door and watched Bloom grade 200 some muskrats for some older guys (greek gods in my young eyes) they got 2 bucks + for their rats.

I spent a good part of my life thinking I got screwed. However looking back I remember how red their rats leather looked (mine was yellow) and how nice and uniform they were.

I also now realize that volume counts, 200 is more than 8, I expect he wanted theirs more than mine.

Later in life I had another lesson from a furbuyer in Idaho. I was sitting around the shop watching what was going on and drinking coffee, a couple of guys came in and started to dicker.

When they left with their #4 grade slippers the furbuyer said to me "you know I never figure out trappers, they will gripe about their 2 dollar coyotes and take them home and take the 1st offer on their 70 dollar coyotes"

He said that he would have paid more for the good ones but he figured he was going to have to overpay for the junk in order to buy any of them so made his bid accordingly on the good ones to offset.

Now the guys walked out with their junk that he didn't even want and sold their top end for the price offered.

Should the buyer stopped them and paid them more for the good ones?

I have my thoughts, what are yours?

Joel

[bobwendt]

only if he was from mn. , lol. in wisc he`d have sent them a bill according to beav.

[ohiyotee]

When fur changes hands it is ultimately the seller who decides the price, if you sell for less than you feel it is worth than that is your fault. Stop trapping if you are not satisfied with the monetary return if that is why you are doing it. Lets face facts : this game is the same every year , so there are no surprises to anyone that has been around awhile.

You know full well what it can be like and i think everyone has had a little warning this year. Personally i would hate to be a buyer I'd probably be the lowest balling son a pitch out there to make sure i wasn't going to take a beating. honestly look at it threw the buyers eyes ,you may see it differently.

[thorsmightyhammer]

But the sad fact Is when groney hangs It up the trapper Is going to be left out In the cold with no place to sell. The problem will be green skins and carcase animals and no one to put them up.

Gary speaks the truth.

Good chance I'll never sell directly to him. But without him alot of people would have no place to go.

[trappnman]

Bob= I have no problem thinking you should get more for oyur live coyotes because of the care you put into them- but don't you agree- that anyone putting in the same exact care- and lets be honest- there are many Bob Wendt protegees using your soft catch methods, etc... should get the same price?

[bobwendt]

not if they can`t put togather 100( or 500) for a load, all vaccinated and wormed, legal and health papered and100% perfect feet and pre-conditioned to pen life including socialization adjustment, wire trained and feed stabilized. it`s more than the trap used, but the diligence in trap tending time, the applied veterinary education etc. I`m not aware of anyone else in the world that can do that but me. I don`t even know anyone else that has a facility to hold or care for that volume. so I do command a premium price. fur is no different. you think a fur buyer will treat psb sweeter on his fox than yours? you betcha he will. fwiw, we are essentially retired from the live biz so I don`t give a flip anymore. any trapping I do from here on out will be 100% on my terms and timelines and interest level irregardless of monetary return. that`s what a good outside income allows a guy to do. whatever he wants whenever he wants.

[roberts]

I would be willing to bet that Phil Brown averages less per pelt, then the average trapper [ from the same area] gets when he brings in 30 red fox skins. same holds true for the district 11 auction. there is only a very limited amount of buyers willing to go out, that far on a limb.

[trappincoyotes39]

Does the car salesmen make the same deal to every buyer? Or does it change with who he is dealing with?
You can't let yourself be a goat and have to have resonable expectations be it selling fur or buying a new vehicle. If more would spend time looking at the market and taking care of there fur and saying NO, then you get changes, they maybe small but you get changes.
Smaller buyers have to make more per skin than larger buyers they all do it on numbers, without it it makes you either a part time buyer or a fulltime buyer. What Jole stated is dead on, I know of a buyer that used to borrow money (short term interest loans) and he bought quite a little when prices where high he ended not because he was foolish, but he couldn't get enough fur to make it worth while after paying back the princple plus interest to the bank, what he had left wasn't enough to justify him buying fur anymore, he treated people fairly but he also needed larger numbers to make a profit worthy of the time and to pay his fur skinners.

[lumberjack]

Roberts- exactly my point in an earlier post.
Most of those guys at district sales or local fur posts wouldnt have enough money for Phils fox or even the the demand/quota for them.
They could get all they need between them (the buyers) from the other 100 or so guys in line, Im thinking, at a slightly reduced price.

[trappnman]

I don't care if its a part time buyer or a full time buyer or a big buyer or a little buyer- if he gives different prices for fur based on who is holding the nose- hes a crook.

and thank God I don't have to sell to such.

[rk660]

Joel's first post on this subject pretty much sums it up: negotiantion skills as a buyer or seller.

Ive seen plenty trappers cry over price paid on their fur, saying they have been screwed, cheated or whatever, and ____ furbuyer is a crook. If they did their homework, knew the approximate value of their fur, knew how to honestly grade it, used some good negotiation skills when selling, they might have been paid more, or, would have walked away if offer was lower than prevailing market was at a given time. They would have had an alternate buyer to get a bid from, shipped to auction or another buyer if they felt they were not being offered market value and just walked away.

Now Ive seen and sure many of you guys too, a guy cries about the price he recieved on fur and being robbed cheated, or taken advantage of. Then same person down the line bragging about buying a $1000 gun for $100 from his buddy whos getting divorced and needed the money. Or that he bought a 100 Sterling traps for $10 ea from a trapper's widow. Now who is the robber. No, I didnt rob him/her, he was dumb enough or desparate enough to take my offer, is their answear.