Givens, Behavior and Coyote Sets

[trappnman]

Someone PM'd me, and asked me this question

"Why is it every time we reach a certain point vis a vis innate behaviors & things proved by trappers for 100 years, we go back to Coyotes 101 and act like these behaviors don't exist, or no knowledge of them exists? How many times can we debate does a wheel work?"

I've often heard about real world experiences vs research- how research has nothing to teach experience. And my thought is this- how much real world coyote experience does the average and not so average coyote trapper really have?

How many trappers are out there, 365 days a year, not only observing coyotes, but collecting factual data on behaviors and actions?

And while I'll grant you that in a macro way, coyote actions during denning, pup rearing etc might not be directly tied to fall trapping vis a vis territory, marking etc but they still matter in the fact that coyotes, like you or me or any living thing on this planet- have INNATE behaviors, behaviors that are ingrained into their genetic makeup, traits that are as natural to them as breathing and as easily stopped.

With all this information available, I just don't understand why anyone would ignore it, and not use it to their advantage.

Because no matter how good you are, not taking into account genetic behaviors seems counterproductive to me.

Well, off my soapbox.........

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I used to be of the belief, that see coyote tracks, set coyote traps. And yes, that works- I did catch coyotes, some years pretty good numbers of coyotes

and the converse is true, more times than not, you don't want to be setting in a location void of sign.

but tracks alone, only tell you a coyote walked there- it doesn't tell you the mindset of that coyote, nor does it put you where "all" the coyotes come.

Hardest thing to do, is monkey with success. I thought I was knocking them back pretty good, took me time and paying my dues to get to that point, so it was hard to change from that mindset.

I for sure don't have all the answers, but I have learned several things, that I take as givens, things that are true, things that can be relied on AS truth-

#1- Coyotes have different mindsets and behaviors depending on where he is.

#2 That these mindsets and behaviors are of the utmost importance, in how and IF, he works the set.

#3- that there is both a set, and location type, that maximizes catch %s.

Unless you trap snow, no one knows how many coyotes he might be missing, coyotes that are aware of the set, but have no interest in working that set- either the set or the location would be the culprit

Even when I think I'm slaying them, I think I'd be shocked by how many I'm leaving.

And shouldn't that be the goal? instead of 1 coyote for every 15-20 or more traps- 1 coyote for every 4-5 traps?

I know that's possible- I WANT that to be possible for me- thus my interest in these type of discussion-

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So all of the above comes down to this for me- location I can only learn via time- and I think I'm getting close on my sets, but I'd like to finalize my search for the perfect set, that set that universally appeals to 90% or more of coyotes coming by.

So lets discuss that

if you don't believe in a universal set, and are of the persuasion that if you set 4 sets, each is different, that's fine-
but I've come down to cookie cutter type sets- not in construction, but in uniformity.

And that set is this: big patterns, copious amounts of lure and multiple lures AND baits. As I said elsewhere, I want that set to be a beacon of fire.....something that rolls on dead pigs and calves, isn't going to be put off by lots of lure and bait (and doesn't research show us the value of loud/big baits and odors)

And lots and lots of urine.

and big backings- I try, but I still most likely use too small of backings- a strong backing eliminates 180 or more of line of travel/sight.

I see pics of these little dirthole patterns, and read on yes, great set and ask myself- are they kidding?

You are trapping COYOTES.

So, I'm sure I ruffled a few feathers and for that I apologize, but I'm serious about trying to be the most efficient coyote trapper I can be and its time to move on to the next level.

I'd be more than interested in hearing comments, disagreements, agreements- and interested in what you consider if not the Silver bullet" set, but your go to set.

[tripleex]

Not that I have the experience to question your cookie cutter approach, but how efficient is this method in adverse weather and soil types?

I think it would be tough to maintain a trapline in especially frozen ground unless you are hauling around barrels of dry or prepared covering?

Cant flat sets be made big too?

Just questions, not being a smart azz here at all.

[gcs]

I can't disagree with your methods, but, when you say big backings, how big?
Boulder size, tuft of grass, a small rock?
"Big" is kinda subjective. Thanks

[trappnman]

Snow.

hate it, and don't trap land in it if I can help it.

I do get a few snow days, but not many.

years ago, I'd run a few coyote traps in snow, and while I soon found holes filled with snow, I also found that even flat sets ,flat sets that I'd think had no chance of drifting, if anything was used as guides, backing, etc they drifted in just as fast, and at least with a hole you have unless tons of snow, indications where the set is. So my winter trapping consisted of the same sets as I used on bare ground, and I'd clear areas when setting and again after big snows.

as far as how big- I don't think you can go too big. Rocks and boulders aren't common here, but I have used round bales & bank walls, seting tight to them.

But more commonly, I use weed clumps and often edges of set aside etc. More and more I'm convinced that I need to pay more attention to the backing as a "stop" rather than a guide

[bogio]

I am very repetious with my set construction, each set lookng very similar to the one before it. I will try varying that somewhat with the coming season to see if I've been putting some animals "off", different strokes you know. That said, I think there is an advantage to developing one set and remaking it over and over. I too believe in heavy lure application, large bait amounts, and lots of urine.

My sets became "coyote sets" when I made the leap to #3 size traps. Digging tools evolved to a pulaski and tile spade, patterns got bigger, holes got bigger and deeper. Drill and augers doing most of the hole digging now.

I differ on the backings as I generally don't have much of one. I going to experiment some with that also. I too consider a large backing to be more of a stop or blockage than a guide. Can definitely see that eliminating 180 degrees of approach to be advantageous although I don't see much apparent obvious signs of back dooring to my sets.

I wonder sometimes if what we see in the snow is an accurate indication of what is happening during open ground conditions. I have no doubt that more coyotes are passing me by than riding in the truck with me. However, with snow cover the entire dynamic of the set changes. You lose most if not all of the visual associated with it and the research shows how important that aspect is. Much of our guiding involves the use of the eyes in combination with the nose to properly line them up. If it's all smooth and white, what do you have? If the hole is blown full, how well is the lure and bait getting out? I realize that in many situations snow is all we have to observe their movements in relationship to our offerings but is it the same?

Tman, with multiple lure offerings are you spacing them similar to your flat sets to give it some triangulation?

[trappnman]

JC Conner and others have told me, that don't ever think what you see happening on snow, isnt happening on bare ground as well- and I believe that to be true.

tons of snow yes, movement and patterns would change, but for that 2-6 inch snow class-

I used to try to smear them on opposite sides of the hole, but decided I wasn't doing much for the effort, and now just put both down the hole

where I'm, remiss at backings, is after a catch, my original weed, grass or been backings are destroyed, and my usual remake is to use duff to create am ound behind set where backing wsa- and i have good success with it-

but I had a few worn out sets, and in snow this year I saw where coyotes where standing where the backing was (1-3 inches of snow) and not coming around front-

I made a mistake last year in being committed to the idea (it was the plan so we stayed the course) of 2 traps- I'm convinced that 4-6 traps at "good" locations will give me significantly more coyotes at those locations than the 2 traps allowed- I KNOW I'll get triples next year, and perhaps my first quad.

[trappincoyotes39]

Tman snow and traps not as productive as open ground hence the heavy use of snares LOL.

Yet I have trapped coyotes on purpose in snow and super cold just to develop a system to be half assed good at it and to keep things from freezing up solid. Not Zagger good but enjoy it at times.

Things started to click in snow and cold for me back in SE south dakota in the early 90's. I can remember many nights at -10 to -15 below highs in the single digits checking and maintaing traps.

Don't set where the snow drifts!!!!!! Use cover and terrian as many of your coyotes in these types of conditions will be in the areas of ease of travel and where the food is.

Some darn cold days for sure!

I have always wanted to trap in every condition I could and work out something that worked with some regularity for the knowledge aspects, but again I will state snares in the winter far less maintenance than traps for sure!

[trappnman]

yes, when I was doing it, I knew right away that if I wanted to trap winter/snow I would have to study drift patterns big time

one other thing that keeps me from winter trapping also, is I don't want to catch any dogs in cold weather- access is another reason, one just doesn't have the access with plowed roads blocking field entrances

[bogio]

Top left is one fine looker there TC.

I don't use snares so just keep hammering along as the snow/freeze comes. Easier to keep existing sets going than build from scratch but if you want to stay on fresh animals you don the safety glasses and start chopping.

With 4 to 6 sets on one location, will they all be hole sets of similar construction? Will each be lured/baited differently?

[trappnman]

they will be like peas in a pod.

as far as lure- yes and no. Multiple sets will more often than not be used more thna once, but with 2 lures plus bait, every combo is different.

my reasoning is this- I'm going to be there a short time. I'm convinced that after each night, the window for taking "all" the coyotes is closing, so I want as many as I can in the first couple nights- then I'll get the stragglers.

And therefore, I'm going to give every set my best shot (the set I think is going to appeal to them the most) and not give them time to "think"

let me put it another way.

Lets say you have a set out- doesn't matter what kind. For that set, a certain % of coyotes will work it readily, a certain percentage will not.

All sets- from sleeper blind sets, to flat sets, to small hole sets to scent posts to big hole sets, small patterned sets, big patterned sets, etc would all have a % with sets ranking higher and lower than the others based on % of "workability".

We all, or should have, in fur trapping a set we think is "the best" meaning the most coyotes, in the shortest time.

So my question becomes- if you believe a set produces more tha other sets (and if you think all sets have the same %, don't be afraid to speak up), then it becomes hard mentally, to put in a set you feel doesn't meet that "best set" criteria.

Now, as I've said in the past, special circumstances are just that- but we are talking about this in %s, and special circumstances are rare, and even rarer in fur season, where I personally don't care what coyote I catch, alpha, beta or pup.

Something else I found out last year, is that due to circumstances, at many of the "spot on" locations, I have very few options where I could set a trap, often just a small piece of ground, so many times I literally made sure trapped coyotes couldn't touch, and made sets that close and wow did my % of doubles go up.

I envison locations with 4 sets in a row, just that far apart

[bogio]

Interesting.

Reinforces my original reasoning for simply repeating the same set over and over. My set, as I make it, has been working. I'm thinking now that multiple lures in conjunction with bait needs to be tried. At this time I'm using specific single lures in combination with specific baits that seem to compliment it each other. These change as the winter progresses with some combos that worked early petering out while others that were lackluster early coming on productionwise late season.

Are you saying that "THE SPOT" often seems to occur in what golfers would refer to as "the rough"?

[trappnman]

Heres a good example- this ground hasn't been plowed for 100 years- its mostly hard sand, gravel, tractors coming and going during part of the day. ground was either literally concrete hard, or in the way of farm operations- I pretty much could only set on the edge I did



4 here at a tight, big backing

[bogio]

You've talked about the hay bale location before and what is there. What is the main draw in your top photo? Looks like a lagoon there? Was it an existing location you've set in the past or one you selected in the search for THE SPOT and if so did it pan out?

[trappnman]

bales were next to pasture, next to a coulee

I've trapped that farm before, but never that spot before- yes, it was a successful setup

[bogio]

No, I know about the hay bale location. I was asking about the other photo where it looks like you set up by a lagoon of some sort. Is the lagoon itself the interest spot or is there something else there?

[trappincoyotes39]

Bogio looking at the picture I think there is a dirt road going across the top of that pond,lagoon what ever it is.