#3 bridger vs #4 duke for YOTES

[seldom]

Mar 11, 2011 19:17:39 GMT -6 CoonDuke said:

As far as your spring power goes for coyotes, I have no doubts that what you use works well in your conditions. Soil conditions and weather play into it a bit too.

And TC, I agree as well because I had no problem catching and holding coyote in my area without all the extra power as well, which brings me to a point that sometimes has become a point of needless, shortsighted arguments.

Though many of us trap coyote, few to none trap coyote in each others areas! I mean, nobody on here is trapping coyote on my properties not me on theirs. Though I'd like to trap on Steves'! LOL I double-lam my canine traps and because of that feel I need to add power to compensate for the 1/2" jaw face resistance plus for the holding power(psi/sq").

So now I just mentioned previously that I can catch coyote without all of the extra modification. well, that's the crutch of me trapping in my area rather then someone else's. First off, my taxidermist-buyer desired no skin damage. OK, no problem so I added lams.

The biggest and I feel the most imortant reason for my modifications (power) has to do with the public. I catch dogs & cats because I'm almost trapping inside urban subdivisions. I've got 30-40 year olds moving out of the cities and buying 20 acres next to my trapping properties and think the purchase of their house gave them the rights to trespass with they're little doggie or kitty(yes, they even walk cats where I trap)

I caught 8 coyotes this year on a property within 100 yds of our city limits and I could see individuals walking in and out of Mjiers and Home Depot stores while killing trapped coyote! I can't afford to trap where I do unless I do everything I can that is either a positive "reality" or a positive" perception" that my traps are "animal-friendly" regardless of the animal.

Two years ago I had a woman go nuts on me that I was a trapper on adjacent property and my traps had sharp teeth. Not just teeth, sharp teeth!! I showed her one of those tricked out #3 Bridger's and she felt so bad she started bawling like crazy and hugged the nuts out of me.

I had two property owners call me late one evening last year and demand I immediately remove a grey fox out of a trap on property they didn't own but felt they could trespass on. I'd even taken both parties to my trap locations(1/4 mile in back of field from houses and behind brush but adjacent to theirs) and pointed out where they'd be set and to please stay away.

They were pissed because I'd caught a fox instead of a coyote!!! In a tricked out #3 Bridger there was absolutely no damage to the fox and this was shown to both parties at the trap site. What do you think would have been the likelihood of a positive outcome or perception if that fox was in the same trap but stock??? Hell, things were bad then but things could have easily got a hell of a lot worse quick!!!

I guess what I'm trying to convey is that we all need to understand not everything, nor every place, nor every instance is the same for everybody! None of us walks in other's shoe's and we all have to work within our own environment to be able to trap.

[calvin]

I probably have more varied beaver traps than I need but ran low last spring and tried a couple Duke #4 OS/ 4 coils I had for coyotes as I had shallow water and needed them drowned. I went away really liking them for front foot beaver. Even have had goof ups where the rear foot got in the jaws but the trap held where it hit. I will use more in the future. Maybe just buy some for coyotes and wash them when beaver trapping.

I don't get the best results from front foot and my TS 85s. This is a back foot beaver trap only, IMO. I don't know the exact problem but I know others have had issues with this trap and front foot positioning as well. Have to set these traps deep...for some reason.

The #5 dbls make a decent either foot trap but I have had rear toenails in a couple (that were new traps). I simply don't think these traps have enough power to grip the tapered foot good enough "IF" a poor hold has taken place, causing the beaver to slide the trap down the tapered foot where it finally hooks up on a toenail and that finally lets go. One of these beaver were ADC...and that beaver got real smart fast and took me a LONG time to catch. I still use the #5dbls but not for ADC anymore unless front foot located.

I would like to try the 750s. Anyone have any issues with them?

Trappnman. Do you have a photo stored of the ridge/stepdown set you speak of? I would like to see it if you have one stored.

[trappnman]

good posts!

no Calvin, I don't. it was tip given to me by old Buzzard. He asked if I was using "poke sticks" to get the front feet down and I told him yes. He said forget those, those are hit and miss- make a ridge in front of the trap.

This can almost always in my sets be done with a trowel- a tile spade works great as well.

I just stick the blade into the mud, which for me is usually "solid" mud and/or sod, and push forwards, that uplifts a ridge of dirt/mud in front of the trap- I'd guess its 3-4 inches high in just about the same depth of water. I also, dig a bed out to lower the trap- mud from there can be used on the ridge if needed.

if not mud- I've used flat rocks (limestone "flagstone type" rocks are fairly common in creeks here), and more often a chunk of upside down bank sod. Its not hard to get that ridge, once one does it.

that gets the beaver walking, and stepping down.

me and old Buzz have had our squables, but that tip, and to skin beaver hanging after opening, made my beaver life much easier.

[thorsmightyhammer]

Calvin there isnt hardly a beaver trap out there with more power than a number five duke.

If you arent getting the back foot buried try more pan tension.

Think about this for a second.

500 in a lifetime will not give the same observations as 500 in a year.

Think its true?

Calvin I dont like the 750s.

I may give them a shot again as I used them the first year they came out and there was probably a learning curve associated with the big traps over the older 4 dls and 4 jumps.

[trappnman]

Mar 12, 2011 12:54:13 GMT -6 @seldom said:

Mar 11, 2011 19:17:39 GMT -6 CoonDuke said:

None of us walks in other's shoe's and we all have to work within our own environment to be able to trap..

Could not agree more. A couple of coyote examples for me-

one was on a location I had trapped for years, didn't want me trapping there because neighbors got new dogs, but could trap down the road a bit. so, new area on that farm, to me it looked even more dog acessable, so I set 1.75s. 7 coyotes in 6 days, no snapped traps.

another was next to a hunting farm- lots of possible dog incidents- set 1.75s, 4 coyotes 2 fox in 5 checks.

Even though my go to trap is different- I set those up with what I wanted to use, if not needed to use and had the success I intended.

[calvin]

Steven, Thinking back, I believe the trap was a #5 Bridger. I can't remember the pan tension but have upped it since. I think this traps still lends itself to "some" catches that may not enclose the entire rear foot totally at times. I have since been sure to place the trap at an angle that eliminates over the jaw catches that has a higher likelyhood for toe or less than total foot catches, however. The incidences did occur when I had less experience with the #5dbls than I do now.

Yes, I like my Duke #5s better than the Bridger #5s.

I would like to know the difference of force applied between the jaws of the #5 dbls vs the Duke #4-4 coil. At this point the Duke #4 has held more less desirable rear foot catches than the dbls. For me.

The stepdown beaver set. OK....makes sense. More commitment, better/deeper grabs.

[CoonDuke]

Steve,

Wouldn't you want a trap that is effective on all 4 feet for those situations when you miss the front foot? I target the front foot too but aint perfect.

When the water comes up a foot all bets are off on those front foot sets.

I have no doubts that beaver can be caught in 6.5" traps, I use them myself. I am just saying that the bigger traps are better because they leave more margin for error.

You said yourself that small traps are not as good for the back feet so there is really no argument.

[BrandonH]

I have to echo CoonDuke. Especially in the spring of the year, water fluctuates almost on an hourly basis some days. Sometimes when you set up for the front foot, by the next day the trap could be high and dry OR under a foot of water. I try to target a front foot, and my preference is a CDR or Bridger #5 always on a drowner. But, that extra jawspead sure helps when it comes to back feet.

[trappincoyotes39]

never tried to set a #5 duke LS but I know the power in those CDR'S the only trap I can't set by hand, again never tried to set a 5 duke though. 5 bridgers no problem.

[calvin]

TC, the spring strength of the Bridger #5 to the Duke is pretty comparable. The dukes might be a tad stronger but nothing to note. The Dukes have a better overall packege, however (Paws I trip pan, center locator).

[thorsmightyhammer]

The first number 5 bridgers I bought werent as strong out of the box as the ones I have bought lately.

Todd, Brandon, we have rivers here that see a pretty good water fluctuation in the fall.

Either they are pumping out for the rice paddies or some have dams that are opened and closed.

Water can change regularly depending on what day it is. Can be a big pain.

[trappnman]

#1- CD- I have duke #5s sitting in the shed- I personally on my situations, see NO difference in success rates over #4s. Setting for front feet, gives one pretty much 100% front feet- I have no beef with anyone, wishing to use a smaller OR bigger trap, and have no desire for converts.

#2- I'm not targeting back feet, with the set I use I don't get many if any opportunities FOR back feet. Back feet action is of no concern. In my area, oddly (where I trap and use the traps) front foot is the way to go as far as possible setups-

its like how can I NOT go for front foots?

which is WHY I went that way

and btw- I learned beaver w.#3dls, coils


3) I've had water come up about 5 times in the past 25 years trapping here- and 2x was in one year.

Its simply not a factor-
one, it seldom rains enough mid Nov through late Feb to be a problem-

two, on the rare, rare occasions it does flood or melt enough to flood during season- its bing bang done- floods last a day if that-

many times- flood is there and gone before I am. You don't get lasting standing water in hills, nor much flucuation.

Water is pretty consistent day after day after week after week. Year after Year after year, season after season.

so- for me- #4 are the ideal tool- do the job right, less weight to carry, FAR less hassle getting beaver out of trap than my Dukes, readily founds setting locations for my style- and as I said, I might not take 1000 beaver a year but I get EVERY one available. I don't leave beaver- ADC work or fur

so for ME, the #4 are the PERFECT trap- which is why the #5s sit

CD stated a broad statement, that I disagree with.

One certainly can be both observant, and have great success, using #4 trap on beaver.

keep in mind- that my comments were ONLY solicited after CooonDukes post, and I'll stand by them.

and please don't think my comments mean that #1 I think that the 4dls is the best all around beaver trap or #2 that overall on beaver, I don't think bigger wouldn't be better.

If I concentrated on beavers, in varied situations and conditions, I'm sure that I would indeed use bigger traps.

none of the above contridicts my response to CD. my specific comments to a specific point, shouldn't be given broader implications.

nowhere did I state anything else-

thanks seldom for seeing exactly what I stated, and meant.

[milkie62]

Has anybody used the rubber jaw #4 dukes for coyote ? We can only have a 5 3/4" land trap and these might work nice for winter hay sets.Pros and cons on rubber jaws for canines. Thanks Ed

P.S. nice site