Dirthole Pic

[maka]

Here is a dirthole I made.

Can you see anything wrong with it?

Notice the coyote tracks in the snow on the right of the set.


Had this happen twice last nite. The other set was a flat set and blended very well. So well I almost couldn't find it.

I have relured both sets this set I relured with Cachottier
and the flat with Pikaubu and XLDC.

I don't know what is wrong maybe just cautious yotes.

I get alot of investigating with out a catch. Alot of it is me with trap placement as I am just learning. But this kinda bugs me.

Any body have any clues.

[trappnman]

I think what is happening is that you are being honest.....

I've been thinking about this subject last couple of days. Each year, with my little late winter snow line, I hold more deeply the conclusion that winter yotes are just different.

I think that late winter snow coyotes 1) stand back more 2) dig more 3) ignore more

Hard to prove any of it- and I too have come to the question- do they do they same that much on bare ground, early?

I don't know. Early, the population is made up of mostly YOY coyotes, so that makes a difference. And its usually an unexploited population.

I've read in a few books, that in late winter, coyotes throw caution to the wind, and stumble into any and every set. I just don't see that.

Part of it is snow. I picked up another yote yesterday, but also had 2 traps dug into and snapped. (btw- you can see the tracks after one of the snapped trap- they are a straight shot away with 20 or so feet between sets of tracks- he was flat out spooked and moving!)

Wiley E once said that he believes a coyote digs more, when he cannot see the source of the of the odor. It's been several years since he said this, and I think of it a lot on the line. I believe Scott was 100% right- coyotes DO dig more when they cannot see.

I think thats a big part of it- snow conceals. To me the age old question isn't the chicken or the egg- but more should you open up snowed in sets or not.

I have no doubt that they will find snowed in sets- I know they do- but are your catch % as high in snow covered sets, and for me- the answer is no.

I think this is for a couple of reasons.

To begin with, you are going to miss some coyotes with snow covered sets that simply are going to be unaware of the set. Approaches must be closer, scenting conditions must be better for a coyote to discover a snow covered set. The long range visual is not there.

Secondly- the snow covering the set not only covers the odor source, but also covers the guides and directionals at the set.

This is a two edged sword- some coyotes are going to stop and smell the set- but just the wisp of odor with no visuals isn't enough, and they pass on by.

Big backings help on the directionals, but also are drift magnets. Weed clumps, etc do the same. So picking backings in snow isn't easy.

But even with direction not being a problem, pinpoint accuracy in foot to trap placement is-

So you got a coyote coming into a set that he can't see, that he works "blind"- I'd expect digging more- I'd expect more snapped traps.

I had one yesterday- the one with the tracks taking off- where he had coal shale and dirt blown back 6- 7 yards. Very visual now LOL

Which is another problem. With no visual inspection of the set- as soon as that coyote hits that soft dry fluffy dirt- no matter where he blundered onto it- he's going to dig.

I had a standback this morning- and one that walked through the set once- missing the trap by a smidgen- the circle to the left of the track is the bottom of the metal detector to mark the trap.



He walked around a little, looked the set over, then stepped in it, then over and on his way....

I opened everything up.

Comments from snow trappers- please

[maka]

Wow Steve

Good reply. One thing I am learning from reading your posts is to just stop and look a little more than I have been.

I really do think K9 trapping all day lately.

The other thing I noticed today I have never seen before.

At a flat set I have I noticed the yotes circled all over and played on the down wind side quite a bit. I'm talking about 10' - 15' from the set. They had scraped away a couple spots in the ground, kind of looked like a deer scrape. Around these scrapings they had pee'd on a clump of grass.

Should I put a set there also? What do you think that means??

[foxtrapperpat]

the lure brings the yote he doesn't work the set try a point set where the dirt hole is dug and the trap is in back to the right or left of the hole

[maka]

"the lure brings the yote he doesn't work the set try a point set where the dirt hole is dug and the trap is in back to the right or left of the hole"

Can you explain tis please

[Steve Gappa]

coyotes urinate for a lot of reasons- and one reason is I believe nothing better to do.....

That is- something about your set bothered him- enough to put him on guard, but not enough to spook him. He took the time to make a few kickbacks (Z must be finally riding that sled or he'd chime in ) and urinate a couple of times while he was thinking the situation over.

You could well put in a "blind"set at these urination posts but with frozen ground- it would be obvious as to something "added".

Since the coyote wasn't spooked, I'd open up the set and relure...

Going back to the thought- do coyotes act the same i snow- I believe ...kinda...

I really do think that much of what we see occur in snow- occurs on bare ground. Sometimes I think its good we don't trap on snow all the time, or what we would see...would make us cry...

I'm a believer in bad visuals- and believe that such makes a coyote cautious, but I also think familiarity breeds contempt- and if the attraction is there, sooner or later he will work the set.

[coydog]

I see a lot more interest in gland lure and urine alone this time of year than what worked earlier in the year. Still get a few with bait and lure, but the sets with gland and urine get worked harder and produce better for ME. Also with the gland /piss combo my ratio leans heavier towards males, which makes sense being a territorial time of year.

I have and do set spots where they have marked themselves, blend back the best I can with no other lures or urine, and had them the next time they came through.

As far as opening up sets, if it isnt a crusted deeper than a couple inches snow, I leave them alone, anything else gets cleared open, or moved to places that will stay blown clear so I dont have to guess and screw with it.

Looking foreward to hearing more thoughts on this as well. Some of you guys get a lot more snow than I get. What works for you?

One more thing, have been doing a lot better keeping sets on and as close to fresh tracks as possible. Ive moved off of great locations with perfect features to set tracks out in more open wandering type locations with tracks and picked off the coyotes at these spots.

No Joe Snow here, just observations.

[foxtrapperpat]

leggetts coyote trapping book shows point set

[musher]

I am not a coyote trapper. I do know a thing or two about footholds and snow.

The first thing is that the snares come out when the snow gets going.

With regards to the tracks. I would guess two things. The first was that the yote could do his safest and best sniffing from where the right hand track is. I think the wind was from the left or bottom left. The second was that whatever was in the hole wasn't enough. The yote didn't want it. Bob would say that the yote should have been slobbering and digging a crater to get at the hole. (What was in the hole?)

In winter/rainy weather I place a wood backing like that more over the hole. The animal must work more to get a snoot full. I also would made the hole on the right end of the log (the butt). It's as if the branch stub steered the yote away from the trap. Yhat rock/dirt clump near the bottom track didn't help either.

I hope I don't sound like an armchair quarterback. Just my 2 cents.

[maka]

Man oh Man

I am so glad I found this site. I have been on the other sites especially...... Ya you no the one, nice site but not near as good as this one. More of a social club.

Anyways, I will take some pics tomorrow of the area and the flat set. As I said I relured this hole with Cachotier so lets see what happens tonight.

I really appreciate everybody's responses. All the info I receive really helps me out when I see the set again.

leggetts coyote trapping book shows point set

Funny you should mention that, I just ordered the books and video's last week.

[Hern]

maka, I can't see a thing wrong with the set construction.
You have a good snow set, good backing, large hole for 'eye appeal'...nice look'n set compared to Steve's metal detector set...no 'eye appeal', no backing...and Coyote walk'n by.

maka, I do notice wind direction is critical on many snow set locations. By that, in your picture...the backing and eye appeal didn't get thishere Coyote and maybe the wind was from right to left as I look at the picture?
I am a firm believer in larger backing, eye appeal and importantly,wind direction when snow trapping (and stinky bait and/or good gland lure/urine)

Steve, do you think it's the snow/late season canines?
Methinks it happens more than we want to admit, WITHOUT SNOW.
(with snow, we can see what actually happens)

[trappnman]

exactly my point Hern- no eye appeal after the snow. There was a backing there however- the grass was continuous until the yote stepped on it.

Steve, do you think it's the snow/late season canines?
Methinks it happens more than we want to admit, WITHOUT SNOW

I can certainly agree that it more likely than not happens more than we think or know. Which is always why I wonder about trappers that say they take very coyote that comes by.

I once posed this question- at a guess, what % of coyotes that are aware of your set- work it?

The answers varied from all but a very few to 1 in 10-15.

This is a subject I often think about and mull over- and it always seems to come full circle.

Some of what I consider facts, probably not going to be in correct order, but as I think of them...

1) Oct 1 has the largest population of "adult" coyotes then any time during the year

2) My catch % rates are highest during this month.

3) I get much less digging during this pre-snow time period.

The funny thing about success, is it eclipses failure. Run 75 traps and pick up 5 coyotes- and you are on a coyote high- even though you had a 93% failure rate.

So with those 5- how many walked on by?

Who knows?

Now in late winter with snow- we have:

1) the lowest population of adult animals of the year
2) most likely an educated population
3) and you have caught the dummies- leaving a skewed population.

That is, the ones that are naturally spooky, that never worked your sets last fall- are maybe the largest group left out there....

In any case, I find a few things to be the norm during snow trapping late in the season:

1) walk bys
2) standoffs, circling
3) more digging (this one for sure is a snow/season factor- I get much, much less digging in fall than winter. I believe this directly is attributable to being covered. I believe Wileys statement 100%- what the can't see, they dig.

So easy to over think this stuff- but its fun and it costs me nothing.... but knowledge is its own reward.. plus a little more understanding, can add a yote or two to your seasons tally.

[musher]

Hern: if the wind was from right to left do you think an animal could walk by that set without smelling it? Without seeing the hole?

[Stef]

Best tip I've found for snow trapping is to use 2-3 traps per set

Sounds a lot but it makes a difference!

[trappnman]

Best tip I've found for snow trapping is to use 2-3 traps per set

Sounds a lot but it makes a difference!

It sure would help in covered sets-

[Stef]

It sure would help in covered sets-

That's it and that's all ;D

[trappnman]

agreed Mac-

also, I find that that early snow is easier on me- fresher coyotes....

a subtle flat set, with minimal guides and no backings, made to be approached directionally- is simply a flat white carpet i nsnow.

When I snow trap- aside from early fall snows- its because I get a stretch of bare ground, so set up- and like washing a car and rain, I know its going to snow- so then I play with it a little. It is pretty but my oh my how humbling.

[Hern]

Musher asks-
Hern: if the wind was from right to left do you think an animal could walk by that set without smelling it? Without seeing the hole?
Yes, without smelling
Naw, saw the hole, sees many holes


Stef states-
Best tip I've found for snow trapping is to use 2-3 traps per set
You got it!

Steve, I stay away from standard dirthole sets when snow trap'n/late season trap'n.
As others mentioned, the game has changed in late season and so my sets change. ( am not work'n with alot of critters at this time of year)

[17HMR]

Hern, What type of sets do you use?

[musher]

Hern: I have a tough job imagining an animal not smelling lure from less than 12 inches away. Some smell must go up before the wind caries it (unless it's a gale!) and the backing would protect it from the wind a little.

But I have seen dogs miss really obvious stuff - from further. Wind can play tricks.