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Post by PamIsMe on Nov 14, 2014 14:02:32 GMT -6
Republican-controlled House passes legislation approving the Keystone XL oil pipeline The Associated Press By DINA CAPPIELLO Nov 14th 2014 1:52PM Boy, with all the things they need to do, they just couldn't wait to repay the Koch Brothers. "House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio, said it was time for the president to listen to the American people, especially after Republican gains in last week's midterm elections, and sign the bill." The American people? I didn't realize that was the big issue on which the Repubs got elected. lol thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/03/20/3417175/koch-brothers-are-largest-land-owners-of-canadas-tar-sands/"...the Koch family’s long-term investments in Canada’s heavy oil industry, calling it an essential part of the company’s massive growth since 1959. In a wide-ranging analysis, Inside Climate News found that Koch Industries has been involved with almost every aspect of the tar sands industry, from mining bitumen to transportation, exportation, distribution and, of course, refining the petrochemicals — a large part of their empire."
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Nov 15, 2014 7:25:50 GMT -6
The president should sign the bill.
Its about time the D's quit with the greenies before they loss the backing of the construction trades.
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Post by trappnman on Nov 15, 2014 7:46:08 GMT -6
well Pam- you don't spend millions without expecting a payback
interesting read:
An independent review by the agency, made public Jan. 31, found that while the project would create about 2,000 short-term construction jobs over two years (or 3,900 if construction took only a year), actually running the pipeline would provide just 50 long-term positions. It also would support another 40,000 "indirect" or "induced" jobs across the country during construction, ranging from canteen cars serving food along the pipeline route to factories manufacturing construction equipment for the project.
“That’s a similar amount of construction work to what’s necessary to build a medium-size mall, and after it’s built, far fewer permanent positions,” says Anthony Swift, staff attorney for the National Resources Defense Council, which has vocally opposed the pipeline. “Keystone XL has been pushed as this national jobs creator. It’s not.”
so Koch's spend millions, to make billions- and republicans can go home and sleep like a baby.....
because, By God, they got something done!
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Post by PamIsMe on Nov 15, 2014 11:48:49 GMT -6
Well hey, as long as they're not building it in my backyard........
Pam
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Post by bblwi on Nov 15, 2014 18:13:43 GMT -6
It may be harder to get support for this bill now that oil has dropped a lot and many are starting to see some of the negative aspects of boom and bust job creation with little attempts to build long term infrastructure or establish community or family based living situations. The fact that the work is located in a very remote area with low population and the pipeline will be as well. We can let the land owners fight this one out.
Bryce
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Post by trappnman on Nov 16, 2014 8:51:36 GMT -6
"Members of congress, voting for Keystone XL today, have taken a combined 39 Million in oil and gas money over their political careers, nearly 10xs more than those voting no"
hmmmmn......
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Post by bobbrennan1 on Nov 17, 2014 4:53:44 GMT -6
It's all dirty isn't the guy who owns a big chunk of interest in rail a backer of the pres.? Can't remember his name now
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Post by trappnman on Nov 17, 2014 7:23:22 GMT -6
I know Obama is trying to change RR retirement-
I guess we can and should all draw our own conclusions over the Koch millions spent, and what they get out of it to decide if its related.....
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Post by bobbrennan1 on Nov 17, 2014 9:46:52 GMT -6
I will agree with you there! It's what's great about this country we do still get to have our own opinion! And vote!
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Post by bobbrennan1 on Nov 17, 2014 9:55:52 GMT -6
Warren Buffett was the name I couldn't think of regarding the rail road and oil sands who is president supporter and anti keystone!
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Nov 17, 2014 11:12:01 GMT -6
Dam straight.
Maybe the libs should look at who is backing the people who are against lines like keystone and sandpiper.
Buffet and the saudi's come to mind.
50 long term jobs on a 3000 mile pipeline is a joke.
IF you guys dont like the idea of pipelines than stop driving your cars and using anything oil based.
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Nov 17, 2014 11:16:42 GMT -6
National Resource Defense Council was cited in that article.
Wonder what their take on trapping is.
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Post by trappnman on Nov 17, 2014 15:17:05 GMT -6
if you don't like pipelines stop driving cars? what a thing to say- no wonder we have gridlock, with attitudes to deny debate posted like that
I never said I didn't like pipelines- but what I will say, is I'm tired of crap being shoved down my throat in a myth of how good it is for me --------------
what real benefit does it have for us as a nation, beyond a few short term jobs?
actually- isn't Keystone to be used for Canada, to sell their oil overseas? what % of the oil in that pipeline, would be sold in the United States? If very little- screw them- send it by boat or carry it in their pockets for all I care
NRDC- so what? are you denying what was said? if so, provide your data, I'd like to see it
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Nov 17, 2014 18:08:25 GMT -6
Tman no offense but you said, I never said I didn't like pipelines- but what I will say, is I'm tired of crap being shoved down my throat in a myth of how good it is for me Much could be said that do not agree with Obama care and how taxes are paid as well and many,many other issues........ I too know for a fact 50 FT jobs for this pipeline is nothing but a lie. Just to maintain the portion that would go through South Dakota would eat up 15-20 people easy, the lift stations and connections and such going through . Your not covering over a pipeline of 1,179 miles with 50 people Also the plan is to be able to tap into this line with crude from the Bakker formation in ND and MT as well, making transporting to a refinery for this as well a cheaper method. They can move 830,000 barrels a day through it. Could end up cutting our dependence on some out of continent oil by upwards of 30-40 percent. We needs jobs and good paying jobs and these will fit that bill nicely. 2 + years of work for many is not short term in my book and would help our economy! far better than more people sitting unemployed. Also other work on other lines being done as well in the south as this will all be integrated into the keystone pipeline plan as well. getting it down there is one leg, the other is to move it directly to various refiners.
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Post by bblwi on Nov 17, 2014 20:43:10 GMT -6
It matters little to me who supports whom and the political bias instead of the science but if the pipeline company needs a lot more than a FT employee for every 23 miles of an in place and intact working pipeline then they probably did not build it the way they should. We should find out how many FT employees are on the Alaska Pipeline for a comparison. I know the pipeline that runs only a couple hundred miles near us that does not pump crude has very few employees allocated to that section, probably 2-3 from what I gather but I am sure it is not the size that this one would be either.
Bryce
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Post by PamIsMe on Nov 18, 2014 3:47:47 GMT -6
"I too know for a fact 50 FT jobs for this pipeline is nothing but a lie. Just to maintain the portion that would go through South Dakota would eat up 15-20 people easy, the lift stations and connections and such going through . Your not covering over a pipeline of 1,179 miles with 50 people " From what I've read, the pipeline will be computerized and controlled from Canada. There will be very little required in maintenance the first few years and it won't take more than 50 permanent US jobs, if even that, to patrol it after it's in operation. Since the weather isn't a big factor like it was in AK, the construction jobs should only last 2 years. "In January of 2010, Trans-Canada CEO Russell Girling claimed that the project would produce 13,000 construction jobs. In April of 2011 the number grew to 20,000, which the Canadian Ambassador reiterated in August 2011. In January 2012 the number was revised back down to 13,000 and this past April the company revised that number even lower, to 9,000 construction jobs. Meanwhile, both the federal government and the Global Labor Institute at Cornell University’s College of Industrial and Labor Relations examined TransCanada’s application and made their own job creation estimates, at 6,000-6,500 and 2,500-4,500 respectively. A State Department study projects only 35 permanent jobs in pipeline maintenance and inspection. Although it seems likely that the Keystone XL Pipeline’s application will eventually be approved by the Obama Administration, firmer numbers will not be available until the project gets underway." An interesting article about how hard it really is to project permanent employment figures and Trans- Alaska vs Keystone. www.forbes.com/sites/energysource/2013/05/10/pipe-dreams-how-many-jobs-will-be-created-by-keystone-xl/I don't really care either way since the whole fracking/pipeline thing has no effect on where I live. There is money coming from both sides, I just thought it was interesting with all else they could be doing the first vote the House took was on Keystone. I wonder if prices keep going down what effect that will have on the Dakotas and the pipeline. Keystone may not get built as fast as it gets approved.
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Nov 18, 2014 6:23:17 GMT -6
Bryce here is your answer far more than 50......
Alyeska Pipeline Service Company operates and maintains the 800-mile Trans Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS). Formed in 1970 to design and build the pipeline, Alyeska Pipeline acts as agent for the three companies who own the Trans Alaska pipeline. Approximately 800 employees work in Anchorage, Fairbanks, Valdez and field locations along the pipeline. The mission of Alyeska Pipeline is to move oil safely, reliably and efficiently. Within that mission, Alyeska has guiding principles in the way business is conducted. Alyeska's Corporate Policies and Code of Conduct set policies, behavioral expectations, and important standards for business conduct and decision making. All employees and contractors are expected to observe the highest standards of integrity when working on TAPS. Alyeska’s Core Values have served our company well in guiding individual and collective decisions and behaviors as well as supporting our company policies and practices. These value statements will remain unchanged and are reflected in our Corporate Policies and Code of Conduct guidelines. Safety: Alyeska is a company where we respect, value and safeguard people, property and the Alaska environment. Innovation: We leverage knowledge and creativity to continuously improve our operations and increase our efficiency. Teamwork: We share responsibility for Alyeska’s mission and the resources entrusted to us. We value our communities, our business partners and the stakeholders we serve. The following links will direct you to Alyeska employment and other opportunities:
The weather not a big factor Pam? LOL. I guess you haven't been to NW SD in the winter? blizzards and cold well below zero cold can and will have an effect unless they get really lucky. Computers can't fix lift stations or look at pipe connections or fix leaks that is done by people.
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Post by bobbrennan1 on Nov 18, 2014 6:23:32 GMT -6
In most cases a single politician doesn't have the power to do any thing and most just do things as a bartering chip to get some other thing to go there way so in the end they try and please every one and please no one! Trusting politicians is like trusting a sales man they tell you what you want to hear and it allways is not what they told you it would be!
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Post by trappnman on Nov 18, 2014 7:44:33 GMT -6
thanks for the facts Pam- that old everyones entitled to an opinion, but....
TC- you are against affordable health care? then yes, we disagree big time-
but health care- brought real, everyday tangible benefits to millions and millions of Americans.
what benefit is the pipeline, for the United States?
we get to buy oil for 1/2 price? Tuesday is fill up for a $1 day?
the benefits seem dubious at best- and I don't care what your opinion of how many jobs is, or stevens- but any reliable study- says the same thing- but hey- lets say they are 100% wrong- so lets double that- 100 jobs
still wrong? double it again- 200 jobs-
hardly worth the hype of a big job producer- and lets not forget- THAT OIL FOR THE MOST PART IF NOT 100% WILL BE SOLD OVERSEAS
what are the fees the states and feds will get? any taxes. import duties involved/
those are the questions you should be asking, instead of parroting the myth this is the best job producer since WW2
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Post by bobbrennan1 on Nov 18, 2014 8:19:00 GMT -6
I have in the last year had wind mills come to where I live they are subsidized by taxpayers I was not in favor of them but I'm sure that just like the wind mills the land owners will receive monthly payments and I'm sure that money will be taxed so yes it will bring a substantial amount of money to people and gov.
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