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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 18, 2013 17:52:19 GMT -6
My wife's healthcare really? LOL. Schools give you the worst healthcare among those that have a group policy in the nation. Under my wife's plan each person has a 5,000 up front deductible so for my family that means the first 30,000 is out of my pocket before anything will kick in period, then after that we still get a 20 percent co pay. To cover my kids the cost would have been 393 a month to add me would have been another 407 a month so almost 800 per month or 9600 per year for my family coverage plus 30,000 up front for any care and then the 20 percent there after good grief. You call that a decent policy? Yep the govt takin care of us LOL.
So I decided to find a job with better coverage and less hourly pay as in the long run it saves some of my wife's income to be spent on other bills and things. So we are all covered under my insurence which I cover 6 people for 328 per month NO deductible up front office visit is 25.00 per vist and hospitol is the first 200 out of pocket and as long as I stay in network I get great coverage, so I sacrificed some wages for really good healthcare. That is how my job search went.I have been where I am at now for over a year.
I agree Steven take care of the kids as they don't get to pick. Medicare takes care of the elderly fairly nice at this point in time.
My wife's retirement means we have 15 percent come right off the top to go into retirement so we are paying for a lot of that future retirement from her paycheck as well. Missouri does have the top education retirement program in the nation, again we did our research on that and the down fall is we loose 15 percent of her income monthly but in 17 years she will have a nice chunk to retire on. yet healthcare will still need to be worked out on how we can afford some coverage when we retire as MO does not offer a discount of any kind on healthcare after retirement so the full policy cost comes from our pocket.
Again if you think for a second govt employees have it better than private sector in many areas that is way off!
I have a friend that has a Retirement plan to be done working at 57 and his plan calls for a move to another country he has been researching with a lower cost of living, good medical care and really affordable prices. o he and his wife plan to move out of country to retire at age 57. He has a good retirement at his work, saved up some and made some good investments so he should be on track to do other things at 57 and live well for many years.
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 18, 2013 17:56:51 GMT -6
So Tman we get rid of ALL insurance and we all pay the govt for coverage what will our monthly cost be? What kind of care will we receive? Will there be waiting lines for procedures? How many people will be willing to spend 150,000 plus on medical school?
300 million people and counting.
Will someone guarantee the healthcare will stay at or above the care we receive now? Will cost go down? If so sign me up.
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Post by FWS on Aug 18, 2013 20:19:17 GMT -6
If it weren't so heavily subsidized by taxpayers, even in the private universities, the cost would be much, much higher.
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Post by PamIsMe on Aug 18, 2013 23:41:32 GMT -6
"Medicare takes care of the elderly fairly nice at this point in time."
Well, not entirely. Medicare, currently $97 a month at age 65, has various limits and deductibles. Also, one must pay out of pocket for drug coverage anywhere from $25-$50 a month or more (plus out of pocket money of up to $2500 for drugs in the donut hole, which, by the way, the Health Care Act is eliminating). In additiona, one needs to have supplemental health insurance (ours costs $340 month for two) to cover deductibles and things Medicare doesn't pay for. And, you end up with 3 separate insurance cards. Thereis a lot of paperwork involved if a serous illness or hospitalization occurs, which can be very confusing, especially for the elderly. With a serious illness, when all personal cash resources are depleted, one can apply to go on Medicaid.
"he and his wife plan to move out of country to retire at age 57..."
Works for some, but not everyone wants to leave the US where they may have grandkids, close family and friends for support. Also can be somewhat sticky if they intend to collect social security when they are at an eligible age. Personally, I would also worry about the cost and quality of health care. I'm sure they will figure it all out when they get to the age where it's realistic to leave.
Cheers, Pam
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Aug 19, 2013 5:53:51 GMT -6
If it weren't so heavily subsidized by taxpayers, even in the private universities, the cost would be much, much higher. Or maybe it would be lower?
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Post by trappnman on Aug 19, 2013 9:41:10 GMT -6
I'd agree steven- I think costs would go down, both at the education level, and certainly at the true cost of HC level.
do I think those at the govt tit, are better off with HC as a benefit paid out of other peoples taxes, than being one of the multiple millions w/o insurance? or to have a pension?
well duh..........
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 19, 2013 15:17:15 GMT -6
What employees would come to the govt tit if not for benefits? Go to mcdonalds lately how has your service been LOL. Also please look at the following gives good insight as to why we are where we are with healthcare cost. Note PBS was involved for all those PBS fans. www.kaiserhealthnews.org/stories/2012/october/25/health-care-costs.aspxNotice number 4 and 7 change these and how much savings is there to be had? My brother in law is a pharmacist and he has money out of his pocket for his malpractice insurance and it cost over 2,000 per year for him to be covered. If he switches jobs it could cost more depending on the coverage the new employer might demand he has . As of now it is like 2,400 per year out of his pocket. He is an employee of the hospital not a contractor.
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Post by FWS on Aug 19, 2013 15:54:55 GMT -6
Nah, just the cost of creating the infrastructure would be cost prohibitive.
Maybe if some enterprise started handing out phony MD degrees like they do with the creationist degree mills where they print up a PhD. diploma in the garage.
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Aug 19, 2013 20:01:01 GMT -6
Nah, just the cost of creating the infrastructure would be cost prohibitive. Maybe if some enterprise started handing out phony MD degrees like they do with the creationist degree mills where they print up a PhD. diploma in the garage. The infrastructure that is in place wasn't put there for free.
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Post by FWS on Aug 19, 2013 21:07:47 GMT -6
No, it was heavily subsidized by government funds. And we can look at every factor in health care find that to be true.
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Aug 20, 2013 18:07:42 GMT -6
Where did the government funds come from to subsidize it?
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Post by FWS on Aug 20, 2013 18:23:09 GMT -6
Mostly the taxpayers of course...................
If we look at medical technologies, pharmaceuticals, trained personnel and so on we see that much of it was developed and the personnel trained with public funding at publicly funded institutions.
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Post by trappnman on Aug 21, 2013 8:31:09 GMT -6
What employees would come to the govt tit if not for benefits
didn't think one of the bennies was a high horse......
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Post by trappnman on Aug 21, 2013 8:37:50 GMT -6
HC costs have skyrocketed, mostly BECAUSE of insurance---
take aways the billions involved in maintianing our insurance structture, and without it- if doctors, hospitals etc knew they couldn't suck at the tit of inflated and ridiculus costs - they would come down.
doctors, and I know this will come as a shock to most, actually once became doctors to SERVE, not becsue of greed.
HC costs were proportional before insurance-
as far as your poor brother in law- getting a vast majority of his income via medicare, insurance etc at an inflated price and profit is indded a sad story- but the millions w/o insurance, who aren't govt employees (reduce the govt, but just not me, my wifes, my dads, etc jobs)and are doing without basic health care, is even sadder.
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Post by trappnman on Aug 21, 2013 8:39:30 GMT -6
Again if you think for a second govt employees have it better than private sector in many areas that is way off!
if you don't you are delusional
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 21, 2013 14:07:30 GMT -6
Steve you pay more now for care without health insurence than you do with it.The only people who see a cost saving akin to health insurence is those that have the cash today to pay the bill off inside a short time period. That is why many negotiations are done between the BC/BS and hospitals is they must agree on a figure set fourth or you have some disruption in coverage by those hospitals.
Take away the buying power of these health care providers what stops then from charging at will? Health care is a free enterprise business. If a hospitol knows they can't see 10,000 patients because of a BARGIN deal gone bad, then what business do they expect through their doors?
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Post by trappnman on Aug 22, 2013 6:25:52 GMT -6
yes TC- BECAUSE of guaranteed insurance payments.
no competion really- take that all away- and its back to actually BEING a free market- and that free market, is not substainable at the current rate structures.
$50 dollas for a box of kleenix? really?
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 22, 2013 17:12:46 GMT -6
Tman how can we have a free market on something like healthcare without insurence acting as the example of cost control? I mean really how can we?
No bargining power and you NEED a heart by pass the going rate is 45,000 say for the sake of argument? No insurence what will you do? You either pay it and if they demand 50 percent up front or no surgery what do you do? You have health insurence they know what they have coming to them and can let the deductible or co pay,ent ride longer than they can the entire 45,000 correct?
How will that be a free market in our mind? You would and could have many hospitals in an area setting the same price within a few dollars of one another. So say you find a hospitol that will do it for 25,000 and only want 10 percent up front now your looking at a waiting list because 97 others are signed up in line before you. So now what?
Yep some charges are out of line but more and more of that is being caught on the provider end upon final payment of the bill. Cost control is also on the minds of providers all the time as well. I had a few bills that had adjustments after the fact what I received shortly after and what the final payment was far different after the adjustments made. It. Used to be most all hospitals had their hidden cost to make up some mor money but in this market of healthcare much of that is going away and is being looked at by the provider. he more they save helps them as well correct?
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Post by trappnman on Aug 23, 2013 8:20:26 GMT -6
insurance is a cost control?
boy, are you out in left field- INSURANCE IS THE NUMBER ONE REASON WHY HEALTH CARE COSTS HAVE SOARED
you think the millions employed by the insurance companies work for free, or without bennies? No? then eliminate the freaking middle man-
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Aug 23, 2013 17:46:56 GMT -6
So we take out the middle man who is the insurence companies then who runs and controls nation wide healthcare? How many employees will it take? What will their pay be? How does the govt try and make deals with medical care? What will limit the cost at a lower rate?
What do we do with those who do not pay for their healthcare? Just because they do not want to? How many will that number be? Will the govt set flat fees far below the cost we pay now for poceduers? What if the hospitals can't run at those lower cost, will our govt then take over those hospitals or close them down? All about profit margin.....
Can we do the same for food and petroleum then too? The govt can control the big 3 and save Americans billions and billions annually?
So how many employees will the govt need to hire to keep track of healthcare and spending for 300 million people?
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