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methods
Jul 22, 2009 8:43:52 GMT -6
Post by mattduncan on Jul 22, 2009 8:43:52 GMT -6
after the recent debates about blind vs pocket and pan tension vs not do you think you can make hard and fast descisions on weather your methods are the best or only way to do things if you olny have a small sample size to base those descisons on , iguess what i'm saying is when do you stop evolving as a trapper and stay set in your ways
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Jul 22, 2009 18:39:00 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 22, 2009 18:39:00 GMT -6
Thats a good question, and one on which I must differ with a lot of people- or at least in public. What is said in private, might be different-
Aren't we back to art vs science?
If a science, then then is simple- one set of methods is the best- and should stand out far over the rest- science dictates repetition as a quaification.
When does a baseball player, stop taking advice on how to hold a bat?
When does holding the bat become less important, then the pitch thrown, the weather, etc and etc?
I think there are a 100 different ways of doing things- and we all decide, based on our particular wants and situations, what works best for us.
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Jul 23, 2009 18:39:55 GMT -6
Post by walkercoonhunter(Aaron L.) on Jul 23, 2009 18:39:55 GMT -6
i try new things every year...dont get me wrong i dont go 100% the new way but i still try a percentage of whats read on these sites from people that sounds logical....im not one of just blocking everything out that people say..i am very sure of my self and my trapping abilities the way they are but if someone can give me a new EASIER and QUICKER way of doing things im all for it....i think myself as a trapper standpoint i will never quit learning something from year to year....its a new adventure every day im out there....
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Jul 24, 2009 6:24:53 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 24, 2009 6:24:53 GMT -6
why change methods every year unless your previous methods are lacking? its not "knowing eveything" is DOING for decades that lends credibity to methods.
I thought trapping was a science? if so- open the book and good to go-
but no- everyone looking for magic potion-
as far as being open, thats not really true- look at the debates on white, blind sets, etc- all by people that don't do it, yet they know.
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Jul 24, 2009 7:59:42 GMT -6
Post by thorsmightyhammer on Jul 24, 2009 7:59:42 GMT -6
why change methods every year unless your previous methods are lacking? its not "knowing eveything" is DOING for decades that lends credibity to methods.
I dont follow.
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Jul 24, 2009 8:21:07 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 24, 2009 8:21:07 GMT -6
worded poorly- but was making the distinction between not knowing by not doing, vs knowing by doing-
and the given, is negative results teach as well or not better than positive ones do-
It continually amazes me, how no experience is given the same credibilty as experience on trapping forums.
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Jul 24, 2009 10:42:19 GMT -6
Post by pat on Jul 24, 2009 10:42:19 GMT -6
Tman, I concur wholeheartedly. The best way to increase your knowledge is by attempting, failing, and analyzing why you came up short.
I used to coach baseball to young kids through teenagers. With the younger kids I used to tell them that we will never lose a game all season - we might be behind when we run out of time or innings - but we will never lose a game. On the rare occassion that we were behind at the end of regulation, we, as a team, went over the entire game analyzing where we could improve and what went wrong. After that we never looked back at that game again except to examine the opposing teams strengths and weaknesses and to find ways in which to exploit them for our benefit the next time we faced them. Young kids are afraid to fail at hitting. Their parents are there, their friends and teammates are there, and if they strike out they know they are going to hear about it from everybody - especially if it is a clutch situation. So what do they do - stand there and let the pitcher strike them out generally. They are paralyzed by fear of failure. To combat that I used to urge the kids to strike out. I wanted them to swing the bat and miss the ball. When they would give me that crazy eyed look like "what the h---- are you talking about coach", I would tell them that they are definately going to strike out if they don't swing the bat, and by swinging the bat and watching the ball sooner or later they will make contact and put the ball into play. The same thing with older more experienced players that were struggling at the plate. If they were struggling it would get into their head and make it worse. The best remedy was to force them to bunt regardless of the situation. Bunting forced them to focus on the ball in order to make contact and put it into play. Once they attempted to bunt a couple of times they got their focus back and lost their fear of failure. But the fundamentals are always the same. The same with trapping.
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Jul 24, 2009 13:20:23 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 24, 2009 13:20:23 GMT -6
good post pat-
its like learning to run a piece of machinery- you can run it just fine, and even if others are there, you need very little help-
but until you have run it when you are only one there that knows, and you need to THINK, you cannot call yourself an operator.
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Jul 24, 2009 13:30:31 GMT -6
Post by makete on Jul 24, 2009 13:30:31 GMT -6
Really good post pat.
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Jul 24, 2009 21:39:38 GMT -6
Post by walkercoonhunter(Aaron L.) on Jul 24, 2009 21:39:38 GMT -6
first of all i have my own methods i follow on my line...but i throw a few new things in from year to year to see if they are credable...nothing major just a different type set something off the wall.....i follow my own style.....steve if i was like you and knew it all when it came to trapping and affraid to try something different well i may just quit trapping......your saying you dont try anything new huh....well then why the big change from duke 1.75's to the montana...thats a change...after all those 1.75's worked for all those years b4? ?
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Jul 24, 2009 22:49:41 GMT -6
Post by CoonDuke on Jul 24, 2009 22:49:41 GMT -6
I agree with Gappa that experience is important...but in my opinion the number of years means nothing.
I would take one years exprience from guys like Phil Brown, Wendt, Zagger, RK, Steven49er, Marbleyes, Blakley, Bill Ilchick, Joel, Waddell, braveheart, and so many more than 100 years experience from a mediocre trapper with mediocre results.
That may sound numbers oriented but it is really not. It is more about men who are at the top of their game in their areas.
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Jul 25, 2009 4:56:59 GMT -6
Post by yoteguts on Jul 25, 2009 4:56:59 GMT -6
Always trying to learn new stuff.
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Jul 25, 2009 5:33:06 GMT -6
Post by The Woodsman on Jul 25, 2009 5:33:06 GMT -6
I am still learning, not really method but technique. A person can become "booksmart" but have no practical experience in applying it. I used to get a lot of whitetail hunting magazines and was booksmart so to speak and then one article I read the person writing it said "There comes a time when the booking stops and the learning begins." That statement made the most sense to me and I have yet to buy another whitetail hunting book. Lesson learned.
I buy a few trapping books to get a general feel on how to do things but until I try it, it is just a theory. One book I picked up written by Bill Nelson was sort of interesting and it may have been the time. He had a lot of you "have" to do it this way. I am by no means dissing his book but I guess I have a really open mind and take what I can out of reading and hopefully can apply some of it to my line.
A lot of internet trappers are sort of the same way. They read what someone else says and then that becomes their experience and is written in stone then they pass the buck. You sort of have to sift through it and take it for what it's worth.
Denny Emery
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Jul 25, 2009 7:27:34 GMT -6
Post by thorsmightyhammer on Jul 25, 2009 7:27:34 GMT -6
If you keep using the operator analogy because of me I wouldnt because its not a very good one.
I've seen alot of 25 30 year old kids with who will outshine many of the 25 year veterans.
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Jul 25, 2009 7:31:08 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 25, 2009 7:31:08 GMT -6
if you think experience means nothing, then you do-
and by the debates here lately, I'd have to agree with you- no experience seems to be desired, even something to be proud of.
guess if you don't know, just say you do----
after all, its the internet...........
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Jul 25, 2009 7:37:49 GMT -6
Post by blackhammer on Jul 25, 2009 7:37:49 GMT -6
Depends on what kind of experience.Years of catching good numbers or years of pissing around catching a few.If a guy spends 30 plus years catching good numbers than experiance is priceless.
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Jul 25, 2009 7:40:30 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 25, 2009 7:40:30 GMT -6
but can we be sure he knows the right terminology?
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Jul 25, 2009 7:42:21 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 25, 2009 7:42:21 GMT -6
blackhammer- isn't the debate, by the hobby trappers, the ones that just trap a week or three- that hobby trappers are just as skilled as any full time or professional trapper that traps for months and/or all season??
I read that constantly over the years-
perhaps that mindset, explains so very much lately-
and there is nothing wrong with being a hobby trapper- I was one for many many years- finally taking more time off, then taking all my vacation to trap, then going seasonal to finally going full time.
My experience, my hard work, my trying to become the best I could be- paid off. I realized my dream. I finally was one of those river rats I had admired all my life. Like making the big leagues for me
And not being around other trappers but family, I was eager to share what I know
the bloom is falling off of that rose..........
With the threads lately, I'm about at the point where anything and everything I know, will just be passed along to close friends and family-
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Jul 25, 2009 7:48:04 GMT -6
Post by walkercoonhunter(Aaron L.) on Jul 25, 2009 7:48:04 GMT -6
as a trapper you can only be set in your ways to a point...you have to change your ways due to weather,people,etc...if you dont change anything your catch will suffer...as i have said before every trapper changes something yearly...dosent matter how minute but there is changes made.....
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Jul 25, 2009 8:06:43 GMT -6
Post by trappnman on Jul 25, 2009 8:06:43 GMT -6
when someone HAS the experience, HAS the knowledge, then the thing to do is shut up and listen- not argue with him.
And if you don't think I have that experience, then you don't have a clue. A few have gone as guests on my line, and a few each year as students- no complaints from any of them as to my experience, as to lessons learned.
as a EXPERIENCED trapper, I'm pretty much set in my ways- the animals are still the same animals. the lessons they teach are still the same, no matter whats stated on the internet-
If using the new "hot" trap or the "new" method floats your boat, then sail away-
its still the animal, and a trap-
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