dryland coon

[netrap]

Would like to hear some opinions on dryland footholds for coon. What do you feel works better. laminated traps or factory double jaws, or do it yourself web jawed traps. How about size? 1 1/2 or 1.75? thanks

[DaveLyons]

Personally use drags on dryland coon. Make the drags heavy enough for coyotes.

Dave

[Kyle]

Do you guys feel that human scent is a big factor in dryland coon trapping?

[bblwi]

I don't feel that laminating coon traps would be the best single thing to look at. I also would not promote the stamped double jaw traps either. If you can find a machinist or welder have them weld a nice machined double jaw insert into your traps. For land I would suggest a 1.5 coil with a good double jaw system or just as is if I wanted to keep costs lower. Number 2 and 13/4 size traps work well in drowning situations and are too large in my opinion for extensive and selective coon trapping on dry land.
The next real question and one to research is how are you staking, holding or setting up drags for your coon? If you are staking solid with shorter chains, 1.5 traps with no double jaw you probably will have more mutilation by the coons. I would suggest a drag system and size that fits your terrain and line. That could be dry limbs, logs, rocks, tie plates, commercially produced 2-3 prong drags but all with adequate chain length to allow for better entanglement. Slide wires may help in heavier human traffic areas if you want to slide the catch to a more secluded spot. If legal you could look at a mix of body grippers to create diversity and also if you want to you can purchase some of the more dog proof or coon specific traps that are more expensive, selective and more single purpose.

Bryce

[trappnman]

you cannot beat a good 1.5 for coon on land or in water.

Staking systems and location (entanglement, overhead cover) do far more to reduce chewing than the type of trap.

[PAskinner]

I guess I'll never understand the idea that entanglement is a good thing. Why use extra swivels, if they are going to be wrapped up in the brush? I used to use all drags and am of the opinion that entanglement will cost you some coon. Some locations you don't have much choice, but if you do, a couple feet of chain and a staked solid #11, center swiveled, has worked the best for me. It's no problem to have brush he can reach, probably helps, but nothing in the circle where they can wrap the chain around it. Having said that, I'm going to more 1.5's so I can use them for canines also. "For every plus you have a minus."

[trappnman]

Where did you get that entanglement means being wrapped in brush? Very, very seldom does entanglement mean wrapped up in brush by any means. Brush first of all, doesn't foul swivels, and if you mean wrapping around stuff- it happens and unhappens many times a night. Short chain on drags doesn't lend itself to permanent "wrapping" around stuff. Those that fear entanglement, have not tried it.

I can count the number of times a coon gets "wrapped" up a season, on one hand with fingers left over.

I cannot ever say entanglement lost me coon, in good coon traps.

Indeed, I can also say that non entanglement never lost me any coon in good traps either.

Not unless you count the extra chewing in non entanglement situations that allows coon to escape.

In my opinion, the #11 is as poor a land trap for coon as you could find. You will never be able to cover it will enough dirt to prevent digging and flipped traps, and still have it function efficiently.

[PAskinner]

Brush doesn't foul swivels, no, but sticks through the trap prevent swiveling. So does a chain wrapped tight in brush. But I am curious how short your chains are?

By good traps, I'm assuming you're using Duke 1.5's? When I started trappng Victor 1.5's were considered THE coon trap. And we used them all on "log" drags back then, that was the way it was done, Rich Faler said so. The idea was that coon would "power out" if they had something solid to pull against.

Just thought I'd do the history lesson to show that yes, I have tryed fastening them about every way possible.
Still had some losses and polished traps hanging in the brush, empty, and gee, the fox traps were holding most of them just fine staked solid, maybe I'm missing something? But, still lost some that chewed out. So, eventually got to using #11's and staking and losing less coon.

I'm not sure why you would have to cover a trap deep to prevent digging or flipped traps? I confess to being puzzled about that one. On dirtholes, you pack them in tight and cover very light. On blind sets, as long as it sets solid and you guide 'em good, you don't even have to hardly cover the trap.

Things that are no-no's for me--really floppy pans-I mean the ones that wobble sideways. Other than that pan tension isn't that big of an issue.
Not using tight guides=snapped traps.
Loosely bedded traps at bait sets- seems to be much more a problem with coon than with fox.

[trappnman]

those "good traps" are what started the present day myth that coon power out of traps.

So, to me, they aren't good traps. As far as what are- use whatver gives you no "power outs"-

Duke does this for me.

Sticks in the swivels could be counted on the fingers left over from the fouled swivels- just doesn't happen in real life for me.

And wrapped in the brush doesn't happen either.

About an 8 inch chain.

If you read my post, you will see that I don't lose coon by powering out on staked coyote traps either. If you are loosing coon in such a manner, then you need better traps.

I've tried every covering on land for a #11, and found ANY covering to be lacking and snapped traps too high to count. If it works for you, then it does.

It does not for me.

I don't like snapped traps. I find that a good 1/2 inch of dirt, reduces that. If you get by on coon with not covering the trap deep at dirtholes, then thats how you need to do it.

[PAskinner]

trappnman said:

those "good traps" are what started the present day myth that coon power out of traps.

You mean the #11's or the Victor 1.5's? I might be missing something, but the Victors and Dukes look pretty much identical to me. I haven't used the Dukes, tho'


I don't find that they power out, although I used to use drags for that reason-- I think there is some truth to the idea of them getting the back feet on the levers at times and 'levering' out of a big levered trap like the Victors were.

And sometimes they just plain chew out of short chained canine traps.

[trappnman]

I thought you said you had shiny, empty traps using victor 1.5s on drags, but not staked solid?

Isn't that "powering" or pulling out? If so, are they a good coon trap?

I do not like victor 1.5 for coon, although they are a good rat/mink and for all I know fox trap. But for whatever reason, when I get an empty shiny trap- its a victor.

I don't get that in Dukes.

I'd never by choice use #11 on land- but as I said, if they work for you, continue to use them.

[trappnman]

Kyle- I feel human scent has little or no effect on coon.

[netrap]

Okay here is the deal. I stake everything solid. Don't have time to look for the animals. Steve, so you are using 11/2 dukes without any laminations? When I trapped in Texas I had so many chewouts in stock victor and monty1 1/2. Would the duke double jaws be worth the money? thanks.

[trappnman]

never used a duke double jaw, so can't answer. No laminations.

staked solid is indeed, the way to induce maximum chewing.

dragging coon properly, you never have to look for animals. My coon are within sight of the set, and on the rare occasions when not, nearby at the end of a buzzsaw trail. Texas had smaller coon then where you are now?

If you have to stake them down not in water, a good wide double jaw, or for that matter CoonDukes bolt under the pan, would most likely help. But remember the coon bmps, barely had their coon pass using double jaws.

[bblwi]

In all probability the advantage of the double jaw on stake solid traps with short chains is not the chewing factor but the fact that you now most likely have a coon caught in a trap by four pieces of metal and thus two major contact areas and two areas of swelling which makes the foot much more difficult for the coon to pull out even if chewing is done or not done.
On factory stamped double jaws on say 1.5 coils, chewing is not eliminated but reduced.

Bryce

[PAskinner]

No, I don't think the Victors are a good coon trap, used the way I used them, on drags or staked solid. I don't like drags, because I do end up looking for animals, plus they tangle in sight of the road, in middle of thorn bushes, wrap up swivels more, etc and so on. But I still use drags when I can't stake.
I would personally would like to try a #2 DLS, with double jaws, swiveled from the frame and about a foot or so of chain and staked solid on land. The long springs tend to fold up and protect the foot somewhat, I bet losses would be very low.

[trappnman]

If the main reason you don't like drags is becasue you have to look for the animals, you aren't using proper drags for coon. Coon drags do not mean long distances or even getting them off roads, out of site, etc.

Coon drags are for one purpose only- to allow SOME free movement.

If they go more than 10-15 feet, wrong drag for the habitat.

I found Victors to be the same as you- I find the Dukes to solve that problem. I can't say I've never had a problem with fouled swivels on coon, but honestly can't remember when.

The double #2 is a dandy water trap, and I have used them on land. But, it takes 2x as big a trap bed, and I want the smallest bed (with a large pattern) as I can get. I also make a lot of coon sets in tight quarters- often between a tree branch off a log, and a double long spring is too bulky for my taste.

But if space isn't a problem, they hold coon well. I didn't see much of the spring folding on log drags in non drowning water sets, but maybe they would do so more o nland.