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Post by musher on Jun 9, 2008 17:49:54 GMT -6
Any opinions on after market choke tubes. Specifically Pattern Master brand ones.
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Post by gunny on Jun 9, 2008 18:07:58 GMT -6
I've always liked Briley choke tubes, no expierence with Pattern Master.
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Post by SteveCraig on Jun 9, 2008 19:19:13 GMT -6
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Post by markymark on Jun 9, 2008 20:36:17 GMT -6
What size shot and what is your payload? If you have a barrel mic take a measurement and call seminolechoke.com they will cut the choke to your barrel. Ported chokes do nothing and the studs that PM uses is all BS Stan Baker did all that in the 60's.
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Post by gunny on Jun 9, 2008 21:31:09 GMT -6
Mark, I would like to hear your thoughts as to why ported chokes do nothing.
The gas is moving faster than the shot column, when the shot exits the barrel the gas can blow through the shot pattern diffusing it?
If the barrel or the choke is ported it can relieve some of the gas and prevent it from distrubing the shot column?
What about the recoil reducing effects?
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Post by markymark on Jun 9, 2008 23:52:20 GMT -6
If the barrel or the choke is ported it can relieve some of the gas and prevent it from distrubing the shot column?
It has to do with the length of the payload, as the payload enters the choke it gets compressed. There's no way to control that except shoot a bigger bored gun with a smaller payload so the is even. Take a 10ga and shoot a 1.5oz load with a F choke large pellets and then a 12ga. Move them at the same FPS The 10 is going to pattern evenly. From all the patterns I have sat down and shot with large shot "mostly Hevi and nice shot" a longer more open choke wins.
What about the recoil reducing effects?
It just doesn't have the pressure of a rifle where porting shines. Browse the web for Cutt's Compansator that has been around for years. They do reduce a little recoil. I do have a few barrels ported but the one that I feel reducing muzzle jump is a top ported Side by Side. I ruined a nice Winchester 21 doing it and after a few years shooting live pigeons I went back to an unported Pirazza with fixed 8 inch chokes.
When I shoot large shot like Heve shot I move it at 1700 ftps. 1 1/4oz payload with felt wads over the shot with 2 slits on the wad. I buy un slit wads and make these slits less than a half inch.
Another reason I don't like a ported gun is noise. When I started shooting my father made me wear those stupid looking metal ear muffs when I got older I started hating the noise. Today I don't even like the sound of a banging hammer. I buy ear plugs by the case. I very rarely shot or hunt without them.
A very good read to understand patterns is Bob Bristor's book the art and science of shotguns.
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richc
Demoman...
Posts: 243
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Post by richc on Jun 10, 2008 9:03:12 GMT -6
I am sure that Marky Mark is right on the money. Problem is, most of us can't afford the expensive custom stuff to make our shotgun shoot denser patterns. My own experience in load/choke combinations seem to point to the fact that every shotgun is an individual animal. You will need to test your pattern on large paper target in order to find the best choke/load pattern for your gun. I tried a PatternMaster once, and my shotgun thought it was shooting the load thru a standard "modified" tube. My present shotgun is an older Browning BPS "Game Gun" that is not back bored, and takes the standard Invector/Win-choke tubes. With copper plated and buffered lead shot, I got my best results with a Hastings .655 extended card shooter tube. It shoots real dense patterns with everything from #6 birdshot thru BB. I did some experimenting with the new "Hevi-shot" fodder recently also. My gun does not like the Carlson "Dead coyote" tube when shooting Hevi-shot "dead coyote" fodder. Best results came with a Kicks "BuckKicker" X-full tube, and Comp-N-Choke" .685. Both of these tubes will reliably kill coyotes at 50 yards or more with Hevi-shot "dead coyote" or lead #4 BUCK. I have a Comp-N-Choke .680 tube, but haven't tested it yet.
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Post by markymark on Jun 11, 2008 18:53:34 GMT -6
A Seminole choke is less exspensive than the PM, you can get a used reloader off ebay for a song. Wads, powder and primers with shot and you can make a custom load that will out shoot and box off the shelf. split it between your buddies and in a few hours with testing you'll never shoot boxed ammo again. When I shoot live birds it has to be boxed ammo, if you have a failure with factory ammo then you get another chance. Handloads there and your on your own. Don't waste your money on copper coated loads there isn't enough copper on the pellets. Shoot nickle. Here's a link to some very hot strong loads. www.bandpusa.com/Shopping/index.php?cPath=80_83In the end a shotgun is just a tube. I have seen once in Spain shooting pigeons where a shooter had his gun break. He came back with an 1100 and kicked all are asses. |
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Post by mat on Jun 12, 2008 7:11:22 GMT -6
when i was shooting alot there was an old man with eletrical tape wrapped around his stock fron buttpad to the reciever. he won the shoot. the next day there where 20 plus guns wrapped up the same way. i walked up and asked him the benifits of the tape and he looked at me, smiled, and said "my stock is broke"
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