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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Apr 4, 2006 15:43:35 GMT -6
Wondering how you guys do it.
Me I go for size. Will use a pliers if necessary.
Also maybe explain why you do it the way you do.
Steve
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Post by JWarren on Apr 4, 2006 16:58:07 GMT -6
Whichever line I can reach with ripping the nails out, I guess that would count as going for size
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Post by 17HMR on Apr 4, 2006 18:37:03 GMT -6
I get as much as I can as per Greg S. at NAFA, he claims you cant over strech them.
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Post by Stanley on Apr 4, 2006 19:10:09 GMT -6
"NAFA, he claims you can't over strech them."
I don't know the guys name, but he does the NAFA fur demo's. And it works for me.
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Post by Mike N. on Apr 4, 2006 21:03:22 GMT -6
I've heard Greg say the same thing. I do like JWarren and stretch to the closest line or in between lines so as the nails don't pop loose.
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Post by robertw on Apr 5, 2006 6:50:28 GMT -6
I stretch for size as well.
Some guys have talked about their beavers tearing loose as they dry if stretched tight....As long as the beaver are lifted up on the nails I don't seem to have much of any problem with this happening.
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Apr 5, 2006 16:34:32 GMT -6
The density guys are in the lead.
Was wondering if one of you could tell me how much more a size smaller beaver with heavier fur is worth the the size larger with a "little" less dense fur.
Please dont quote em the price of a select in a grade fur isnt the only factor in a select.
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Post by thebeav2 on Apr 5, 2006 18:24:05 GMT -6
If you really think that stretching the fur to It's limit makes It less dense then you should talk to someone that has put up more fur In one week then most of us have caught In a lifetime. Every year I have very high averages on my southern beaver you want to know why, i have a person that puts up my fur that knows what He's doing, and knows what the market wants. I rest my case.
Gary
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Post by Stef on Apr 5, 2006 18:26:02 GMT -6
This is an hard question to answer because we "cannot" see the quality of the fur to begin with.
But here's my 2ยข...
If you over stretched a "Heavy" beaver and it turns to a I-II in quality... it can be a difference of $10 and even more a piece when beaver are selling well. I prefer selling a large heavy beaver for $30, compared to an over stretched Xtra large for $25 or even $30 for example.
Less nails for better furs ;D
Stef
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Apr 5, 2006 21:53:13 GMT -6
This is an hard question to answer because we "cannot" see the quality of the fur to begin with.
But we can see what is paid for articles of fur of any quality. I say that a semi heavy of a larger size will almost always pay more than if said beaver was a heavy of the next smallest size.
I say the driving for the market is size not "density". Now mind you Stef I seldom have one go I-II. Probably was caught before november 1 and the one next to it will grade a semi.
If you over stretched a "Heavy" beaver and it turns to a I-II in quality
It isnt possible to "overstretch" a heavy into a I-II. Anybody that will tell you it is is well...cant say because no way to "prove" it but it isnt happening. I will venture to say it isnt possible to "overstretch" a semi down either except a real borderline. And even that is at the discretion of the grader.
Me I would use a come along on em or a winch if I could.
Gary if he is who I think it is and I know it is(brain teaser for ya). It safe to say he know more about putting up beaver for the todays market to maximize profitability than maybe anyone.
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Post by Stef on Apr 5, 2006 22:14:35 GMT -6
Anyway... If we use well designed pattern from the auction houses... its pretty hard to over stretch a beaver if you follow the line.
If you over stretch the sides.... You'll have problem close to the hind legs (breaking) and also around the head.
Stef
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Post by musher on Apr 6, 2006 4:52:26 GMT -6
Maybe you can't turn quality into inferior by over stretching. But you can make inferior look better by stretching real baggy.
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Post by trappnman on Apr 6, 2006 7:15:01 GMT -6
so beaver then is the one fur in the world where its impossible to over stretch?
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Post by thorsmightyhammer on Apr 6, 2006 7:24:06 GMT -6
I dont really like NAFA's pattern and its what I just happen to have on my boards. I use it only as a primarily as a guide follow the lines rarely.
I like the looks of FHA's newer pattern but I am too lazy to change over. Any new boards I make will get it. If I dont like that one maybe I will make my own. Or just maybe there isnt a "perfect" pattern and we have to treat each beaver like the individual it is.
Musher is it worth more because it looks "nicer"? If its baggy I am sure it will go a size bigger.
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Post by thebeav2 on Apr 6, 2006 7:24:58 GMT -6
Your right 49er If I were to go to someone and ask for coyote Instruction I would ask Bob If I were going to ask about fur put up I would ask Greg. In other words you ask the PRO Do you guys really think that when you pull that hide that extra few Inches that all of a sudden there are all these voids between the hair follicles, come on you guys really don't believe this do you?
Gary
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Post by trappnman on Apr 6, 2006 7:27:10 GMT -6
don't know beaver- but you darn sure can overstretch leather to the point it thins out.
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Post by thebeav2 on Apr 6, 2006 7:41:13 GMT -6
Is that before tanning or after.
Gary
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Post by Steve Gappa on Apr 6, 2006 8:05:28 GMT -6
well, tanning shrinks the leather........
so you are saying tanning will bring it back to the "natural" shape no matter how stretched?
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Post by robertw on Apr 6, 2006 8:52:20 GMT -6
"so you are saying tanning will bring it back to the "natural" shape no matter how stretched?"
No matter how the animals is stretched and dried it is still the same sized animal when it is tanned.
The beaver market is driven (currently) by the number of square inches of usable pelt...so the bigger the beaver the higher the value of the pelt.
I don't think a beaver pelt can be over stretched..How ever, I'm not using vise grips and a winch either (joke). As pointed out by Greg Schroeder and others in the industry.....There is a considerable price difference between a medium and large medium sized beaver. I stretch my beavers to the full size of the pelt.
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Post by trappnman on Apr 6, 2006 9:57:01 GMT -6
ok- I accept that-
HOWEVER- stretching definitely affects the "thickness" of the fur. I'll stand by that.
So- if a grader feels that the fur doesn't "feel right"- would not he suspect overstretched- and downgrade it to the "finished" size?
I would.
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