The "edge" on Pocket sets

[lumberjack]

What do the big pocket set guys out there consider to be the "biggest" attribute to a pocket sets success for coon and taking every mink that investigates also?
Hole size?
Depth?
Location?
Bait?
Guides at the trap?
Water depth?
All the above?
Anything else?
Ive used pocket sets in limited numbers for many years but am going to set them heavy this year.I guess what Im trying to say is what is the most important aspect of the set in your mind.Thanks

[Edge]

Having coon and mink where you are setting,that would be #1.

I think that if you bait or lure,you should do it high in the hole in the back,so it can remain useful(as in *not*underwater).

As for the subtle intricacies of the pockets,I dont think it matters a bit.

Guiding at a pocket set should be moot;put the trap in front of the pocket.You can put bg guides to insure shore travel tho,but if you have to "guide" to the pocket,you picked a poor location.

Edge

[Clefus]

I'm not a "big guy" but...
start with location...then if ya got a smelly hole...they will check it out... ;D
I think these are more important...
Each trapper develops his own set construction but stick with a few fundamentals and work out your own system for best success...

[CoonDuke]

Also be sure to have little to no pan tension. I have seen on more than one occasion two mink tracks directly on the pan at dry pockets and they did not set the trap off due to too much pan tension.

[trappnman]

Hole size?
Depth?
Location?
Bait?
Guides at the trap?
Water depth?
All the above?
Anything else?

Some of the above-thats for sure.

Hole size for sure is important- I construct pockets completey different if going for coon or mink. If both- the pocket is made for mink.

for mink- smaller pocket- about the size of a softball opening- for coon- a big pocket 2-3 times that size.

Water depth- you will do better on coon in shallow, wadable (for the coon ) water.....mink it doesn't matter.

main difference is trap placement- for mink- tight to the hole- guide sticks around the edges if needed.....for coon, I like the trap back 4-6 inches- 1 guide stick BEHIND the trap (so trap is between guide and bank)

[Corey]

I don't have many mink so I can't comment on them, but as far as coon go, one thing that Rich Kaspar told me really seems to help, that is use alot of bait in your pocket. It seems like here in Nebraska we have alot of coon, I usually bridge trap them for the first couple weeks two set per bridge on drowners. It seems like after the first coon gets caught the other coon will clean out the bait in the hole and be back the next night to get some more. I don't use any lure other that the fish oil I mix in with my ground fish, i throw the bait back into the hole splatter it real good that usually lets some of the fish oil run back out of the hole it leaves somewhat of a oil slick down the creek. fwiw. Corey

[Traveler]

I like EYE APPEAL and lots of it.I slick the hole down with my wet hand and add "claw" marks with a fork tool.Deadly

[JLDakota]

I believe all the things mentioned by everyone have significance in the whole scheme of things and we all evolve over time to place different values on the importance of things based on our experiences. For staight coon I like big showy pockets as they can be seen from great distance. Lots of bait, a dog guard on a 1 1/2 just outside the hole and a means to drown him if I'm on a 3 day check.

As Lumberjack asked to also catch any mink that came along in his coon pocket, I would make this "combo" pocket (the combo pocket is what I usually use on water) deep with an upward slant if possible, higher then wide to handle rise in water, with the width of the front door no wider then trap. I put the trap just inside the hole with the dog at about 2 or 11 oclock to place the outside lever of the 1 1/2 coil spring to the side of the hole with the chain out of the way. I make sure chain has enough slack to be pushed down in the mud to minimize paws from feeling and pulling on chain. "Big" chunk of fish or rat will be jammed in the back of the pocket and a shot of shellfish/salmon oil squirted in and around the hole. This year a dab of JT's 10 bucks an ounce Mink Eliminator will be put in the roof of the pocket. (Can't have an opinion next year unless I try it this year) ;D

Although this was identified as a coon pocket thread, it identified the desire to catch the mink that came by. Therefore, one more tip I'd like to share, was shown me by Tom Ross, a very fine MN mink pocket setter friend of mine. For those that subscribe to putting the coil spring just inside the hole try this. When you are all done and ready to leave the set, stop and as your last step, use your hands to push, squeeze or mold the mud of the entrance to the pocket to make the entrance be a half inch smaller on both sides (and up 3-4") then it was prior to you putting the trap in. You have now enclosed the trap just inside the doorway and the mink can't sneak into the pocket from water level without stepping on the pan. I'm taking for granted steps were already taken to landscape making the bank face near veritcal in the first place. Does shrinking the doorway make a difference? IMO, it without a doubt does but then I always attempt to put all the odds in my favor I can. Try it and make up your own mind, it just takes a few seconds. Jim

[trappnman]

Good point on narrowing down the pockets JL. On my pockets in clay banks- stuff that holds its shape well, I usually do that- so the pocket looks like the mouth of a pottery jar. So to speak.

[Edge]

That *is* a good point.When I kick my holes in,the shape is already ovall'd,ovaller,ovulating,ovulated,

*not* round.Kinda pinched down to the width of the trap.

Edge

PS I just noticed the "big pocket guys" part......I am no mink trapper so you dont have to read my stuff.........

[lumberjack]

Ya know,JL,I often thought about cutting 6 or 8" scrap plywood and cutting an upside down "u"or hole in it and cementing it with mud in front of the pocket,but thought they would just be more to carry and maybe a problem with coon pulling them out if they werent staked somehow.
With the hole it would work like a weasel box,and the trap could be set on the inside,insuring a nice high catch.My trowel digs a nice 6" hole,and the mud plastering sounds easier.Heck,there is no shortage of flat stones in my area,I could just set 2 side by side leaving a 3" or so slit if need be.
Maybe Im just complicating this more than it needs to be.
How about pocket depth,no one really commented,what would we agree is the shortest depth a pocket could be without bait stealing?I live in some tight creekbank area,and a deep pocket isnt always obtained.

[JLDakota]

Lumberjack,
I find that the molding of the pocket entry is usually very easily and quickly done, almost like playing with modeling clay. All that's important is that space is made "some amount" smaller then it was when you put the trap in place. Nearly any amount of closure forces him over the pan.

If the digging allows, I try to get the depth to equal the majority of the length of a narrowed down tile spade and like a shelf in the back so my bait sits mostly above water. I don't peg the bait in the back but use my tile spade to wedge the bait tightly so its doesn't fall down into the water and float out. I would also add that I attempt to make the chunk of fish look like a chunk of fish back there with visable scales or light underbelly showing. A muddied up piece of "glop" has no eye appeal as far as I'm concerned and I want either the mink or coon to visually identify what's back there. Works for me. Jim

[Wright Brothers]

So now a light bulb clicks on. Thanks guys. I learned to place the trap outside the hole, so that it would work for approaching the hole or any furbearer walking along the edge of the bank.
The first check after changing to outside the hole, I took my biggest coon to date, so naturally always did it this way.
Is this why I don't take the mink I should be?
Do the mink see or feel the trap and avoid it?

[Edge]

"Is this why I don't take the mink I should be?
Do the mink see or feel the trap and avoid it?"

First,I caught my first-ever yote in as trap that was bedded practically vertical.......I too,decided *all* my traps should be bedded that way.......but not for long...LMAO!

Mink run tight to the edge of my pockets,an outset trap would miss many,also remember to pre-drop the pan if necessary.

I have never seen mink sign indicating they "avoided" a trap,they just 'went' the way they 'went' cuz they do.

While using the mighty(but frozen)vic #1 coil,I had plenty of opportunities to witness mink tracks on,around,over and between the trap jaws and pan....they are used to bumpy stuff;it doesnt seem to bother them.

Edge

[JLDakota]

I do not believe mink see, or pay attention to the trap submerged in the entrance of the pocket. I want to think he's looking at that big chunk of fish in the back. ;D I shrink the door way only to take advantage of what Edge referenced and that being his "nature" to hug an edge. If his side is touching the edge of the door when he enters, IMO his "off side" foot is going to be on the pan.

I feel that setting just "inside" is dependant on having a "big prize" in the back of a deep pocket to make him enter. I feel if I can get him to enter the hole I have at a minimum from 1 to 8 chances of him stepping on the pan.

I know of some outside the pocket setters who position their traps just to the right or left of the pocket in a blind set application and are confident that they are picking up the edge crowding mink also. They wouldn't be doing it that way if they weren't catching mink. Try their way, try sitting in front as you do, and just inside the pocket. You'll settle on one of them that works for you.


Jim

[trappnman]

My thoughts on pockets are that more likely than not, a unbaited pocket works as well as a baited pocket on mink in mild weather and early season.

Esp a pocket made in good locations.

I do think that in colder weather, when mink are hunting a little harder, bait and lure do increase your catch....

oh, no they don't..

they do...maybe....

I've debated this issue with Gappa time and again when we are on the line....I really think that the proper blind set will take a mink as quick- and since my pockets are on location- lure/bait is un-needed...yet I do lure and bait periodically in cold weather...just in case.

For blind set pockets- I do think that making them where, for example a mink would naturally rest...or in the first "huntable" location are a bare stretch...improves your chances of success.