Lure Use

[Ridgerunner]

Steve, I am inclined to think as you do, in that it is likely the particular odor itself, and not the amount that brings out a rolling response.

With the call type lures, I take pains to ensure that I get that smell well down in the hole with no spillage.

Another thing that I think is neat to do, is to set up a rolling response ie: pin down a flattened road kill, and throw in a post set about 15' - 20' away. I have made catches this way. Keep in mind, I am a hobby trapper, and I like to play around with things like this.

[trappnman]

I can see a good looking girl and she is attractive, but of she also smells good, she can be irresistible.

Once told a girl..... man, you really smell good..and she replied...I taste even better...

Yikes! I was trapped!

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I often have wondered about is a traveling coyote a hunting coyote, and I think that more times than not, thats true. With what intensity, thats another story. Obviously, if a coyote has an empty belly, hes going to be more in that hunting mood. With hounds, its a fact that a hound with a full stomach, doesn't give you nearly the performance that a hound with an empty belly will. Thats why you feed rabbit dogs at night, and coonhounds in the morning.

But even with a full belly, a coyote will be, I'd think, opportunistic.

But if the "hunger" isn't there, how and if he works a set changes. Less intense if you will. Which is why I like multiple lures at a set. If one thing doesn't ring his bell, something else perhaps will.

One of those little mysteries is trapping in snow and seeing reactions. WHY would a coyote walk up to a set, stand back, then go 50 yards down the road and be sitting there in an identical set? Both snow covered, so visuals are the same as well as scent.

Familiarity causes a "might as well check it out" scenario?

I also tend to believe that many coyotes are not caught first time through. They come through, "see" the set, but don't work it. Yet, later that night or the next day or week, there he is. I know its nice to think that a coyote comes through, walks straight to your set and BANG there he is in the morning, and sure many are taken that way...but how many are taken 20-30 minutes, or more after being aware of the set?

I am convinced, that visuals are if not the silver bullet, at least a bullet. While I do think that some coyotes aren't interested or at least not at that time, I believe firmly that poor visuals are the #1 reason for standoffs and poor working of sets (from the side, back, etc).

Hard lines, contrasting textures, etc. Make a set using dry dirt so that the trap pattern is obvious by the color of the dirt, and you will get few coyotes. Using dry dirt has one main fault (not counting that you can't compress it) and thats that it usually is a different color than wet dirt.

While I don't think you NEED to use a lot of lure (remember we are talking this many drops vs that many drops), I don't believe it spooks coyotes, for me, here in my area.

Without a doubt, using more lure is just another reason (location being #1) that I pay zero attention to wind direction.

[Bob Jameson]

It comes down to the credibility of a set presentation with regards to the odor push or concentration of odors.The eye appeal or what most now are referring to as set visuals will help support the case of the smell or strong odor coming from the displayed visual.

Depending on that odor push if the visual doesn't appear to justify the odor in that animals mind or experience he may well casually investigate the set , pass it by with little or no real interest or work the set. He will know it is there and may just return later at any given time.

In the case of the rotting cow carcass or deer etc. they see the big carcass and expect it to smell to high heaven. It is a credible acceptable presentation. The strong odor is quite expected at this setting.

However big push odors or complex and at times uncommon odors coming from an obvious not so believable set up may and does cause caution at times. As far as reactions by some canines they just do not see it as so attractive or interesting enough to jump on the opportunity. It just doesn't add up to them.

There are always animals not caught that just keep on going that give such a set up not so much as a good look over . That is a canines characteristic trait that we can only attempt to interpret its reasoning.

I do know when you make something very natural ,subtle and with just a hint of attraction that an instinctual or inquisitive urge is triggered therefore finding that presentation far more attractive and inviting. You then will most likely catch that animal that just isn't that interested in that big bold odor.

I would much rather use a practical set up with an inviting set, with moderate odor push that is on location then try to "super skunk food call/curiosity lure" a set in hopes of getting more out of that initial luring application.

Regardless of the amount of lure used at a set that canine will find and know that scent is there if you are reasonably close with your location selection. A few drops will be detected just as readily as a full 1oz. bottle it wont matter when talking trapping in reasonable weather conditions. Even with cold temps a canines sense of smell is still tremendous.

Considering and understanding their ability to detect and track a rabbit, route and follow their den mate or cold trail track a paired mate or follow random drops of estrus blood etc. Their ability to smell ,track and act on that perceived odor particulate is nothing short of amazing.

I have found that much emphasis seems to be placed on the value of how much lure to use. The trend and interest should be how good are your location selection and sign reading skills and where is that set best positioned.

A mans success with canines as with any animal is determined by ones abilities to put your sets in the immediate travel space of that target animal.With that task done the rest is easy. A few drops of a good lure and a nice smear of a good bait will take just about every canine out there. No rocket science here at all. You do your job in the necessary areas that need to be addressed and they will come one at a time.

Too much emphasis is placed on lure usage it seems and not on the skill factors that really separates the wheat from the chaff.

[trappnman]

what intriques ME, is that 5 drops of lure is good but 10 drops is too much. Thats where I draw the line.

A stick pushed into a lure bottle is the accepted method many use- and how many drops is that?

I have found that much emphasis seems to be placed on the value of how much lure to use. The trend and interest should be how good are your location selection and sign reading skills and where is that set best positioned.

A mans success with canines as with any animal is determined by ones abilities to put your sets in the immediate travel space of that target animal.With that task done the rest is easy. A few drops of a good lure and a nice smear of a good bait will take just about every canine out there. No rocket science here at all. You do your job in the necessary areas that need to be addressed and they will come one at a time.

Too much emphasis is placed on lure usage it seems and not on the skill factors that really separates the wheat from the chaff.

Agreed.

But wonder- how many drops are there in a "smear of bait"? Cause to me, any prepared bait, is no more than thick or chunky lure.

keep this in mind- the standard dropper issued with a medicine bottle is 15 drops per milliliter and there are 30 ml's per fluid ounce...so there are roughly 450 drops to an ounce.

so how many sets do you get out of a ounce of lure-

if you get say 15-20 sets, then the "average trapper" uses 20-30 drops per set.

in quanities this small- does one or two drops less make any difference?

luring a litlte heavy does 1 main thing- keeps the odor there longer.

[Bob Jameson]

By equating into drops no I don't believe a few plus or minus drops will matter depending on the lure type and overall strength of the product. Bait on the other hand depending on its composition and even tho it may or may not be doctored alot or a little it still represents a more natural but some what altered odor which even altered by natural odor is still a more acceptable and natural occuring scent compared to a formulated lure.Odor concentrations make a big difference at times.

I have found that one can use a measurable amount of bait and do well with just that alone or to add a squirt support of some urine. Bait use at a set adds considerable credibility to a set especially when complimented with a few drops or a stick dip application of a good lure placed at the set.

There are many possible scenarios and combinations that work but some presentations will work and invite investigation more readily by a canine then others. Meeting several criteria that may interest that animal is the key to an aggressive response.

[trappnman]

good post- I agree.

will be using more bait this year- esp in WY

[Dhat]

i notice a good bit of rolling on backings or rubbing up against them leaving hair on the backing where the lure is applied. even with mild lures you will see it especially in the summertime. i think allot of it is some of us use different methods. even at a shoddy set if a coyote is going to try to roll he is probably gonna be caught long before it gets to the point of him rolling. most of you who stake traps never get to see it simply because once hes caught the lure is in the catch circle whereas with dragging traps which i do the coyote goes out and hangs up and if another coyote comes by the set he can hang around and do whatever he wants rolling included. alto of even mild baits will be rolled during the summer and even though you may no notice it as much with traps put some on an m44 and it becomes more noticeable due to the hair sticking to the waxed top. my experience is if he rolls it he knows where its at and sooner or later he will pull it may have to change baits though. noticing the rolling more on m44s also leads me to believe that when using traps most coyotes even with a bait they would usually roll on are simply caught before they get a chance to roll

[Freak( Jim V.)]

Just a thought , but the fact that a coyote and or cat is known to rub on certain lures is a justifiable reason to aplly that lure in an elevated position beyond the trap. The rub set is common for cats but can also be used on canines in certain situations.
And , this is turning into a very , very good post.

[ColdSteel]

I agree Freak thats why I couldn' believe some people haven't had any rubbing or rolling.How many of you have ever had snapped traps with long hairs in the jaws?I know I have, some not a lot but I do blame it on rolling

[Steve Gappa]

How does a canine rub or roll? that is, what does he do first?

Smell it.

A canonme just doens't come up to something and drop and roll- he puts his nose down into/to it, then he rolls.

I've read where some people don't WANT a rub or roll response and I always wondered why. I'm not all that convinced, from watching dogs, that canines rub all that much. Cats rub for a reason- they have glands on their face and they wish to deposit scent.

....but rolling- thats one of their most natural reaction to intriguing scents- they want that scent on their body (or they want to cover that scent with their own, take your choice).

I want a lure that invokes those kind of responses.

On old sets, I want to see that blown out crator, that matted grass, etc-

On active sets, hopefully they will have their minds taken off rolling by being in the trap.

[Steve Gappa]

some of those long hairs are gotten by the coyote laying down and crawling toward the set- set type can eliminate much of that. (stepdowns for example)

[ColdSteel]

Tman you are right on with that answer.I have less trouble than ever with stepdowns with snapped traps or guiding him to hit the pan with the stepdown