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Post by dj88ryr on Jun 8, 2006 7:55:39 GMT -6
......"Redneck Clothsline" Zagman LMFAO!!  ;D ;D |
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Post by Maineman on Jun 8, 2006 8:17:14 GMT -6
Tom, the redneck clothesline picture is a classic...I would have expected to see it on one of the threads that discussed washing fur. ;D
I see you get those black belly red's up your way as well...
Dave Z
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Post by z on Jun 8, 2006 12:03:33 GMT -6
Atta boy Boonie..... Get in there! Ggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.........   |
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Post by z on Jun 8, 2006 13:06:00 GMT -6
That coyote was a classic..... On the way up there Zagger turns and says I don't really have much faith in these sets producing BUT....... Thats where the farmers tell me they SEE and HEAR them all the time! We crest the rise, Zagger grunts, stomps the gas, Punches me in the head, Punches me in the shoulder......We got a double, We got a double! Dude, Hit me one more time and I'm gonna bite your ear off.  Good way to end the day amidst the bruises....... |
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Post by Wiley on Jun 10, 2006 13:49:08 GMT -6
Zags,
Get a real trapline dog! LOL!
Let me guess, the infamous "Dorn dogs" right?
I don't know anyone who has compared a "dorn dog" to a kemmer cur who has a Dorn dog left.
Don dogs are "all foam and no beer"!
Hope I didn't offend you! LOL!
~SH~
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 13, 2006 13:16:34 GMT -6
Chalk one up for Wiley and Bob, I caught the wet bitch today in a very small crawl under area in the fence to the East! Been a few days since last checked this area and she was pretty smelly but I could see from her nipples she was the match to the male full of lamb! She was a stocky coyote but didn't look by her teeth to be very old. Lambs have been good I was not finding any new kills and now should have this deal taken care of. No pics as I forgot the camera at home.
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Post by bobwendt on Jun 13, 2006 15:54:01 GMT -6
if she was a yearling, she likely was laid up in the den with very young pups while sisty ugler and the mate were hunting. those first year females whelp a full month later than the oldy but goldies. once got 4 pups only 1-2 days old from a den ( we dug it out to be sure was even a den, as very little sign) on june 4th ( northern wyoming). late and small litters both on the yearlings. anyway, glad you got her. finding the den might be near impossible, but I bet they are less than 2-3 weeks old and shouldn`t last long.
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Post by Zagman on Jun 13, 2006 16:31:24 GMT -6
Wiley pontificates:
Zags,
Get a real trapline dog! LOL!
Let me guess, the infamous "Dorn dogs" right?
I don't know anyone who has compared a "dorn dog" to a kemmer cur who has a Dorn dog left.
Don dogs are "all foam and no beer"!
Hope I didn't offend you! LOL!
~SH~
Now Dammit, Wiley....you know the rules...make fun of me, the wife, my mom, whomever.....but NEVER publically discredit my dogs!
I am a part timer....so these "all foam" dogs suit me just fine....when I hit the big time, I'll move on to those squirrel dogs some of you use.
Zagman
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 13, 2006 16:54:56 GMT -6
Bob couldn't tell you how long on she was with the pups could tell in the past she was nursing but if still milking who knows to far gone to tell. The beetles where working her over good.
I'm thinking this place will be an ongoing issue as it sits in good coyote habitat and as the other family groups get to running in awhile with those young pups, more troubles will be commin. Keep working around the sheep with snares and traps and the neighbor 4-5 miles North thinks he may have a family unit on his place. Will go call them here soon and take away that opportunity as well. I want him to fair better than past years and I'll see that he does. In the past he has waited too long before he has called I told him this year call at the first kill and I know it has made a big differance.
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Post by bobwendt on Jun 13, 2006 17:10:24 GMT -6
why wait for the first kill? let the first kill be yours! I know it`s hard to talk those ranchers into pre-emptive strikes if you are private and getting x dollars a head, or hour ,or job. been there done that, tighter than the bark on a tree they are. now if you are w.s. the son of a guns call you if they see a track in a waterhole- a 3 month old track! actually I wish I was gman , but I just can`t afford it. it is work right up my alley and I`d be vary good at it. but the dollars and cents penciled out just don`t cut the mustard compared to what I can make in other trapping endeavors. anyways, more power to you guys. you all are like the last cowboys ,doing what you love in spite of stinky pay. good thing illegals don`t know how to trap or you`d be down to 700 bucks a month and a sheep wagon and no bennys except all the dead ewes you can eat and a 50lb sac of taters a month.
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 14, 2006 14:36:28 GMT -6
Bob I love lamb chops ;D. Had the 70 mile drive there again today, Rancher called last night and he has purchased the great white hope"Pyrenees dog". I don't know if one will cut it for that many head and the big pasture with many draws but he seems to want to try it,so I'm down to calling and airplane use only no more traps,snares or m-44's due to poor fencing and those dogs can roam along ways. We will see what develops.
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Post by bobwendt on Jun 14, 2006 15:12:49 GMT -6
about 1/2 of those white elephants are a good investment, the other half run off to parts unknown, take up with the coyotes and breed them even, or worse, end up sheep killers themselves. seems to matter not how hard you try, how many you catch, how low you get the kill rate on sheep, the rancher is always looking for the magic bullet and there is always this trapper 3 counties or states over that is better than anyone and "if we just had him here....". like tom krouse says, every trapper is a hero and a bumb- a hero when he catches the coyote and an instant bum if he fails on another in a timely manor", lol, like that rancher is carrying you totally so you are supposae to camp on him 24/7 and let everyone else think you are the bumb. see, I HAVE been there done that , trying to be everything to everyone and it just isn`t possible. If I was just as good as that guy 3 counties over......
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Post by Dhat on Jun 15, 2006 6:30:58 GMT -6
best thing for you or the rancher either one would be if that dog got killed or run away. only place ive seen em work is where there are no coyotes lol. good luck
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Post by bobwendt on Jun 15, 2006 6:54:25 GMT -6
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 16, 2006 13:11:50 GMT -6
Dhat I wouldn't say there all bad as I know a few ranchers they do a good job for as nothing in coyote control is 100% or close to it, except eliminating the problem coyote/coyotes.
One of my ranchers has such a good dog every fall it is a chore getting the sheep loaded for sale barn as one of his 3 dogs just goes crazy and can get down right mean and nasty when you try and take them sheep away.
The thing is they need to come from good stock and not just bred to be a big white dog or handled by kids all the time. They limit a trapper ability to use all tools at his disposal and that can lead into some conflict when it comes to heavy cover and killing taking place. They are sight dogs and need to be able to see well and areas of heavy cover you need more than 1 to have any real effect on limiting kills.
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Post by Dhat on Jun 17, 2006 7:23:10 GMT -6
yeah ive seen some that stayed with the sheep good and looked like they worked well but what happens when that ewe slips off all by here lonesome to lamb. only place ive seen em worth having is some of the ma and pop operations where they have a few sheep or goats in a very small pasture. ive seen enough negatives such as the instances bob mentioned to think they are more of a hassle than they are worth. one case they were with sheep and were going several miles and killing goats. I think that more damage is caused by the hinderance that they create for the control man than they make up for. if you consider that they are taking away three of your tools ( m44s, snares, and traps) which are all good tools and replacing it with a tool which is inferior. i never understood the reasoning of pull all your snares out of the fence and all your traps and m44s from all the adjoinging pastures when they get a dog . if that dog is going under the fence or screwing around in the next pasture then he isnt with the sheep and isnt doing whta hes suppose to. ive had enough instances where the dogs took away all my tools and the coyotes kept killing and the blame went to me when the rancher was told repeatedly if he would lose the dogs problem could be solved easily. these were instances where cover is to thick for airplane and too thick for calling in most instances. two times the rancher sold sheep and all and went out before he would get rid of the dogs and try more effective methods yet still the blame went to me lol. hopefully your ranchers have more sense
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Post by trappincoyotes39 on Jun 17, 2006 7:55:40 GMT -6
Yes that is the same scenarios that are a negative for all who do predator control. Yes you need to pull equipment as "most" say there dog won't roam he will stay with the sheep and then bang your butt is in a sling with the non target catch. I think there are alot of prideful ranchers and they try to do for themselves, but many come to find out the great white isn't the total answer or the situations you mentioned the answer at all.
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Post by Wiley on Jun 26, 2006 6:23:01 GMT -6
There is four variables that affect how well guard dogs will work.
1. The training of the dog
2. How spread out the sheep are
3. The roughness of the terrain
4. The number of coyotes in the area
If the dog is not trained, if the sheep spread out, if the terrain is rough and hinders visibility, and if the coyote population in the area is not kept in check, the guard dogs will fail and fail miserably.
I have not had a guard dog man yet that did not eventually call me.
In fairness, well trained guard dogs in the right conditions can be an assett in reducing predation.
It's easy for a "biased" ADC man to run down all guard dogs but that would be being less than honest. I have seen them work and work well but like anything else, they have their limitations.
If an ADC man's goal is to truly reduce livestock depredation and you are willing to do what it takes to accomplish that, you can train any guard dog to avoid traps and M-44s. Trap a gaurd dog in mild weather using the same lure. They'll learn to avoid your sets. When you catch one, rope him with a stiff rope and tie him back. He'll have no problem getting loose and he'll only limp for a couple days. I have also placed cyanide shells loaded with hot pepper near their dog dishes (to avoid accidental pulls by coyotes) and trained them not to pull M-44s. Use the same baits and lures you train them with.
The best predator control efforts will utilize all tools in harmony.
~SH~
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