T-Man's Stepdown specs

[buckeyehunter]

T-man I was looking at the archive on the stepdown set. It is hard for me to see the size specs of the set from the pictures. Could you give me a rough idea how long the set it from the rim of the hole? Also how wide is the set at it's longest point? How far would you say the trap pan is from the hole? A sketch with general
measurements would be great....

[trappnman]

The measurements aren't really exact- and I find it is best to err on the side of a little bigger rather than too small.

An average set is made with the base about 10-12 inches wide, and each leg of the triangle going to the bait hole a little longer- say 16-18 inches.

The bait hole goes straight back right under the sod- I usually make it 8-10 inches deep.

The trap usually goes tight into one corner or the other- usually the right corner- out of habit, no other reason.

I have experimented with the trap tight to the hole- with clods in the bed as guides....jury is still out on this
setup.

I also frequently make a ridge of dirt along the side opposide the trap.

[buckeyehunter]

Do you have success with this set on fox or is the trap too far from the hole?

[trappnman]

I have few fox here- but % I would guess about the same with this set as any other.

I did have one set 2 years ago, a stepdown, that took 3 coyotes and 4 fox in 10 days-

The makeup of the set, usually (with guides) makes the corner the natural first place to step.

Make sure you have guides in front of the trap (between the trap and the lure hole)

[woody]

Steve, I understand guiding, but why the guide between the trap and lure hole???

[dj88ryr]

So in order to work the hole, he has to step in the spot where the pan is, some critters might step over your pan to get at the hole, if the best spot between the hole and your pan is your pan, thats where he puts his foot.

[woody]

OK! lets see if I got this right in the step down that Steve makes, you want to put in guides such as sticks and pebble between the trap and hole and leave the area over the pan open. but the rest of the pattern should look rough and not a good place to put one's foot or paw? Have I got it???

Man you guys make it hard on me to understand what you want ;D But I am learning new things and thats the important part woody

[dj88ryr]

You also have to take their stride into consideration and visualize a couple steps back to guide as well, so that by the time he gets to the pan, his next stride puts his foot on the pan.

Woody, I am still a tenderfoot at guiding, I am hoping to have more light shed on this topic at the canine demo, but at least this is the quick over view as I take it from Steves explanations.

[woody]

DJ, want to hear something Scary ;D I have learned more in the last month from this site on K-9's then I could have from books. I know the 2 yotes I caught last year were caught in regular dirtholes, with a little guiding, all I done in the way of guiding was to make a diamond with small rocks, clogs and sticks, with the hole being the top of the diamond. I put the rocks on the left of the trap, a small dirt clog on the right side of the trap and small stepping stick on the back (side closest to me) of the trap. It worked for me. ;D I think this will bring up my next post but that will be tomorrow I have to hit the hay so I can make it to work in the morning

[Zagman]

Curious....what % of coyotes do you get by the back foot in this set?

Not that I care which foot I catch them by, I just wonder how guiding works on backfeet once the front feet are beyond the trap.....

I am really learning a lot by watching Rusty mark.....after the first sniff, his feet move fast and in are put down in a lot of different places. It really makes me realize how hit or miss foot/trap placement must be at a true urine/post set....and maybe to some degree, flat sets.

Zags

[dj88ryr]

Zag, the 3 yotes I got this year were all front foot catches ( luck ) I have taken a few by the back foot, but like I said, I suck at guiding and really hope you guys can turn the light on at the demo in June.

[trappnman]

I get some coyotes by the back foot in this set, but not as many as in walkthroughs.

I've never experimented much with larger stepdowns than this- but did experiment with smaller and smaller stepdowns- with diminishing success.

THis size of set seems to be about right- the lure hole and pattern is such, that a coyote steps down into the pattern with1 or 2 front feet- but seldom (I am guessing here) comes into the pattern with a back foot. The backfoot coyotes I catch in this set are more than likely caught crossing over the pattern rather than walking up to and on it.

I did experiment with placing the trap tight to the hole, with a small mound of dirt behind the trap- so hole, trap, mound.

I had some success with this and will continue trying it.

Zags- canines and their ability to "trail" is something that has always intriqued me. I was well aware of this ability in snow- but never thought much about it on bare ground. This trailing ability is done utilizing all 4 feet.

I am of the belief that canines almost subconsciously "know where their feet are at all times"- for lack of a better way of stating it LOL

Look at a dog in a kennel with a couple on piles of scat on the floor. THat dog will, almost without effort, more times that not walk, even run in the kennel- avoiding steoing on the piles of scat. Now- get that dog excited and aggitated- and then his feet are like Grandpa's long johns in the washmachine- arms and legs flopping all over.

I believe this same ability extends to canines working a set- back guides are just as effective as front guides.

Woody- basic guiding is as you stated- place objects around the set to make the coyote step where you want him to step. A tight boxed effect as you describe, will work- but looks unatural and will, if not spook a coyotes, cause him to avoid putting his foot there.

I think coyotes have a simple phlosophy- if it looks "funny"- it is. And if they are unsure about something- they err on the side of caution.

Go back to your 4 cornered guides. Remove one. the effect is still the same. Remove 2- chances are, the effect is still the same. Remove 3- and with set position and natural "guides"- the one last placed guide, mighht well be enough.

Now- take those 3 removed guides, ponder a little- and place them further out. The effect is still the same.

Guiding is, to me, an art. Watch a good coyote trapper making a set- his hands are never still- brushing, moving, adjusting...until it just "looks" right.

[trappnman]

It really makes me realize how hit or miss foot/trap placement must be at a true urine/post set....and maybe to some degree, flat sets.


When I first started making flat sets- didn't have a clue. Just knew flat sets didn't have an obvious dirthole.

I had tons of misses, walkarounds, through over, etc. Enough so that I QUIT making flat sets for a period.

Thats when I read about the walkthrough- and thats also about the time a light clicked to take advantage of natural guides- and making the presence of natural guides a prerequisite for most of my flat sets.

For me, in hay fields, the clumping aspect of alphafa provided the perfect natural guide- pick a dust circle among the right clumps- half your guiding battle is over.