Coyote avoidance....

[Steve Gappa]

I guess if you consider urine as a "lure" (and I do ;D ), then my setup is similar to 17kiss's setup

[dj88ryr]

Still would like to know why the triangle set up nailed 3 fox, and the straightline didn't produce anything buut a possum. I actually used Cachottier, Extreme #1, and Pikaubua in the holes, I also sprayed the manure backing with urine both in front of and behind the trap. I there wasn't something there to produce olfactory overload, they were dead. Note, it was very cold when I used this set, and there was about six inches of snow on the ground, it was also the week after deer season closed.

[Steve Gappa]

LOL- I think you asked and answered that one DJ ;D

[Stef]

wasn't something there to produce olfactory overload

Stef ;D

[Steve Gappa]

Since we all have occasional avoidance and tracks on the pattern, what do you do...besides curse....

If there are just a few tracks on the pattern, and I feel the canine was "lucky" and no more- I simply put a small pebble or clod in a couple of the tracks- trying to make sure the coyote has to change his pattern next visit through. I believe that the next coyote will use the same track pattern, so feel it is important to change it so the stride is different.

If the coyote stands back or just walks by- not much yo ucan do- except relure if you think that might have been the problem (if it has been after big rains, many days, etc).

The frustrating one are the ones that KNOW the trap is there- and step everywhere around the trap- digging holes from the side, back- walking all over like they were having a dance.

This can be tough to correct. A quick solution that does work to a degree is to rough up the set area- a big pattern- and mist the whole thing quite heavy with urine- and then relure with a different lure.

If I think it is a color problem (ie poorly blended trap) I try to blend in more- and have been trying the "fake pattern" theroy on a few sets. Sometimes you just CANNOT blend in the pattern- for many reasons. While a lot of times this causes no problems (witness the successful use of coal shale by many) some times it does. I found that if I made a couple of "patterns" around the set and before the set itself- so the coyote sees & smells these fake patterns first- a lot of his curiosity about the patterns vanishes before he reachs the true pattern.....trappnman

[dj88ryr]

So am I taking this right Steve, you think it was nothing more than letting the area get back to normal after deer season, and that the straightline walkthrough would have produced those same 3 fox, if I had left it in place long enough?

[Steve Gappa]

I'm a firm believer in that if you thought the location was good to begin with--to leave it there.

It always amazes me how you will have a set out (you, not me LOL- all mine connect... for a couple of weeks- and nothing. No action. So it gets pulled- and you come back 2-3 weeks later- and the set is all tore up, tracks and scat everywhere...

Last spring- most of the sets I made were made in the exact sets as the previous fall- as long as the sign was ther..why not.

[Brian Roberts]

I have some yotes avoid sets I'm sure, I also have some dig from behind at dirtholes.
I have more of this on clear nights, also I think wind direction if it is blowing can have an effect on working a set from the side or behind, after all most dogs hunt into the wind.
My answer is to make at least 3 if not 4 or 5 sets at good location, I've had yote doubles next to sets that were sprung or contained possums and coons.
If he'll work a set thats to our advantage.
I don't like mixing lures at a set, unless were talking about urine as I will sometimes use it along with lure, bait or all three.
I'm not saying it doesn't work its just that with a few sets at a location I already have used a few different kinds of lure.
These are the things that work for me.
This is an interesting post to say the least, hopr its an indication of things to come on this forum.....B.....

[Iowa gods country]

I feel it can be from several factors, one being a hard line most often found on snow conditions, but can be a set that doesn't or isn't blended in well, they come up to the "pattern edge" and then circle or back off and be on there way, afraid to commit to the pattern, I feel this happens when you have strong galnd lure, or other strong smells, I feel it's ussally a subordinate coyote comes by whenthis happens.
Next situation would be could be odor problems with the trap or scent left by your presance if late in the day when you make the set and coyote comes by that night, I see more of a problem with this on high humidty nights, there nose works better just as any canines, more scent dispearsed I feel.
Some coyotes just don't like the smells put before them and move on there way, again dealing with younger meaker coyotes, at this time of year I use a strong gland lure with pairing up taking place and find I catch more mature males and females with a good gland lure and urine. trappincoyotes35

[ChrisM]

Too many trappers think "Natural" means "Blended."

Natural means "not constructed in appearance".

I've seen some well blended sets that looked terribly constructed.

[Steve Gappa]

Guys- for those of you that don't know ChrisM- I can tell you 2 things about him..1) he knows coyotes- I consider him one of my mentors and 2) he has an absolutely gorgeous wife and daughter.


I would agree with what you said. Blended is indeed not natural.

You said something once that stuck with me (see, I DO listen)- you said "I wish I had a nichol for every dirthole I tried to force in place".

Some trappers walk in and think- I'll make a dirthole and a scent post here

I make what sets "fit"- could be 3 stepdowns or 3 flat sets.
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What do you think of this statement:

I want a coyote set to look like it was made 15 minutes before he got there- or in place for 20 years.

[wileylew]

I think maybe a lot less lure or maybe your lure at a dummy set and a little gland in a pencil size hole ,with trap blended.Works here when dirt holes dont

[dj88ryr]

Point is well taken Chris, of course many think the terms mean the same thing, you explained that one so even I could understand it.

[trappingcoyotes35]

Good point chris, thats why I made referance to a hard line, natural and blended means to me a set that fits in with the natural surroundings.

[k9]

Not to complicate things here but when we discuss avoidance we must look at other things that factor in. I would agree with the previous posts, when talking about avoidance at new sets.

However avoidance at remakes opens a new can of worms. Circle shy?

That can be visual especially if you are using short chains in wetter conditions.

Can also be due to the smells. Maybe the last coyote you caught there was a dominant one, and the hesitant coyote is not. He might come over but he might hesitiate to enter the circle.

Having said that I personally think that many canines are actually attracted by the torn up circle.

Doubtful that we can figure out 100 % of them, however the fact that trappers are observant enough to even know that they are having a problem speaks highly of them.

[17kiss]

K9, welcome aboard! I see alot of this in Pa. Have yet to catch another coyote in a coyote remake. Always heard it was hard to do with our coyotes , now I believe. there has to be a reason behind this also. Have caught reds, greys, and coons in coyote catch circles , but never another coyote.Starts to look funny after a few catches. circles lined up.

[Steve Gappa]

Welcome k9- now if we could just get that Wiley E to come back to the light and rejoin the rest of the world...

When you are out on the line- you will look at a situation and just say "theres no reason in the world for X to happen" when in fact more likely than not there IS a reason- we just don't see it.

I'm bullheaded about coyotes- heck, trapping in general I guess. But coyotes are the newest thing to me- I learned water trapping growing up - its second nature to me and its easier to troubleshoot and understand.

But coyotes- I learned to trap coyotes like a nut. Absolutely did not have a clue. All I knew- you needed BIG traps and you used a dirthole. But after taking a couple of coyotes- or more accurately- after NOT taking a couple of coyotes, I was hooked.

But the more I think I know about them -the more exceptions to the rule I see! Part of this of course is simply being more observant. And part of it is gaining a skill level that makes me notice misses more.
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Part of being a good trapper is to constantly be learning and to constantly be evolving. And with coyotes- there is an amazing amount of knowledge to be learned. And applied. Which brings me (finally) to catch circle and remakes.

I read where trappers always have a clean set in next to remakes. Heck- I'd run out of traps. if I put out 75 traps- within a week all but a very few would have made a catch of at least something. So just about all are remakes very shortly. I do find certain types of remakes are more productive, and stepdowns remade back into stepdowns account for most of my high mutiple catches at remakes. For example- I have taken up to 7 coyotes from the same stepdown in a season plus a few fox besides.

And I have tried putting in a fresh set at locations that have taken a few yotes- then go dead- and never was really impressed with the results- seemed if I would catch an other coyote there- it would be in the old set anyway.

I did find out however- not set in stone- that if you put in a fresh set RIGHT AWAY after taking 2-3 from a previous set- the fresh set seems to connect within a day or so.

I think that k9 hit on it- WHAT coyote was taken the previous time? When you get 2-3 in a row- littermates?
I think it would be a good lesson to keep track of the age and sex of each coyote- and see if any pattern develops in catches at remakes. So that if you would catch an old dog for example- you might want to add a fresh set.

When I was younger- I would try to get good numbers by runing flat out. Now- I try to do it a little smarter- and part of the "smart trapping" is maximizing the numbers at each location with the fewest number of traps.

So now I notice the misses more. When I pulled a lot of the line this year- conditions were right so that tracks were somewhat easy to see. I had several location where I could see tracks close to the set- but they wouldn't commit. Almost without exception- every trap pulled at these sets (most had taken a few yotes, coon, etc) was excessively rusty.

So- did the coyotes avoid the remake because it was a remake, or because of the rusty trap? Is that why you often catch 2-3 in a row from a trap- and then it goes dead? That after taking the locals and the trap sits- by the time the next ones come through the trap is rusted?

heck- I don't know.....trappnman

[briankroberts]

I have also noticed multiple catches at stepdowns, I do however like a subtle post set at locations that have made Coyote catches. I have found that a lot of my doubles the second coyote is in the post set. I think if he's wrapped up in the other yote being caught and gets antsy the subtle post set is just the ticket to take him. I had one location where I took 11 this year and 4 were off of fresh post sets, three doubles at that location.....B.....