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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 15, 2004 14:08:55 GMT -6
You guys have convinced me waxed dirt is the answer- and a 1 to 4 formula sems about right.
Lets hear some more about its making and use. From what I hear- granulated wax is granulated wax-
does the dirt have to be dry to start? will wax coat moist dirt or not as well? (or at all)
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Post by dj88ryr on Jan 15, 2004 14:58:18 GMT -6
No experience making this as I have always been a proponnent of using dry only. But I think you have convinced me of the need to have a 100 gallons or so on hand. I thought I had enough dry dirt on hand this year, but with all the rain we had, I went through it at an alarming rate this year. Now I am stuck, so using waxed will be an option next year, especially if wet then freeze conditions are expected. So I am as interested in you as to how to make it correctly.
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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 15, 2004 15:11:10 GMT -6
Funny how things evole- when I frst started land trapping- it was to take a few coon in the 10 days to 2 week period before water trapping opened.
As the coyote bug got stronger- I resisted using dry dirt- thinking that was for "sissys" LOL
Well once I started, I was hooked- Now I'm bumming when I get low on dry dirt. Its great and I would use it all the time if it stayed either above or below freezing.
I like glycol. It worked real wel lfor me and did the job. I'm thinking like a lot of you have told me- use a combo of all three.
I think that if you would use glycol early with the local dirt at the site- yo uwould be able to get at least a few weeks into the season- then switch to waxed dirt.
At a price of around $5, you could get enough wax to make about 200 gals- and 200 gals (with less weather remakes) should last the season. As far as making it- I bring home a 5 gal bucket a day during sunny, hot weather. I spread that out on aboard and in 1 day its bone dry- so adding wax SHOULD add only a day- and that, if I plan well (yeah right) should work.
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Post by RdFx on Jan 15, 2004 16:11:33 GMT -6
When i make waxed dirt i use only DRY dirt and if it isnt dry i put it out in sun on top of black plastic till dry.... I use a cement mixer and add five gallons dry dirt and then the appropriate amount of wax. I use a propane torch and put in mouth of mixer and adjust flame so i dont get flame out. One cannot put torch head all the way into mixer as it doesnt have enough oxygen. I keep torch going till all of dirt gets a dark wet look and then you know wax is mixed throughout the dirt in mixer. I dump wax out into wheelbarrow and let cool while doing second batch. When second batch is about ready i take dirt in wheel barrow and put in five gallon bucket. I leave lid off yet till wax dirt cools down totally and then put sealed cover on. I do about 150 gallons a year and it holds out as i use other methods in early season.
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Post by skidway on Jan 15, 2004 16:15:17 GMT -6
I make waxed dirt as needed as soon as the temperature dictates it. If I planned a little better I would do it when the weather is better but never seem to get around to it in time. Storage is also a problem so I heat dirt (wet or dry) in a pan on the stove in the garage to a temp that wax will melt in. Stir it around and you're done. About 20 gals. in an hour if it's dry; 1/2 that if wet.Next year I'll be prepared (yeah,right!).
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Post by trappnman on Jan 15, 2004 16:22:22 GMT -6
so does he porportion of 4 to 1 seem right? and how about price?
Will the wax melt down in hot temps? Is that why storage is a problem?
skidway- so you wax wet dirt. Do you think the wax is coating the wetdirt or that the dirt is drying out over the stove?
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Post by coyote on Jan 15, 2004 17:04:19 GMT -6
Steve, did you mean $50.00 per 200 gallons?
how do you guys store either the dry dirt or the waxed stuff? my "scent-free" square footage is seriously lacking.
I just got a turkey fryer for Christmas...looks like I'll be cooking DIRT!
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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 15, 2004 17:14:23 GMT -6
kinda- $50 for the wax to make 200 gals- if the 1 to 4 formula is correct.
I have 4 barrels that I store my dirt in- but I think I'll buy some of those plastic totes. If they can keep Cachottier IN- they should keep odors out of the dirt.
I can see how waxed dirt would absorb odors more so than just dirt.
But can you store it after it is waxed in a hot shed. I know waxed traps get shiny in hot weather- does the waxed dirt?
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Post by Appleknocker on Jan 15, 2004 19:02:03 GMT -6
While waxed dirt may make a very nice set, isn't it rather cumbersome to haul around? We had so much rain and mud that would freeze at night you had to walk rather than drive to check your sets so you would not cut the farmers field all up. I tried Cedar Fiber to bed the trap and it worked great above and below the bridge here in Michigan. I had to cover with other material such as ant hill dirt and dirt from around the set. I also used the glycol mixture but am not real pleased with it. When things froze up that glycol changed the color of the trap bed. Made it darker and looked wet. If I used less to try and stop the discoloration - set would freeze. I had coyotes stand along the edge and not make that last step. I figured it was the different color from using the glycol. Any thoughts??
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Post by dj88ryr on Jan 15, 2004 19:14:15 GMT -6
Appleknocker, although I have never used it, I have heard guys that use glycol say that because of discoloration, you need to make a BIG dirt pattern, or at least spray a big pattern on the last step.
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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 15, 2004 19:28:29 GMT -6
The color change fear is weird- some places it doesn't seem to matter, other places it does. For me- color is a big deal.
So DJ is righht- spray a big pattern. I'll over spray 2-3 feet on the sides- it also helps to toss just a little dirt around- just to soften things up.
Appleknodker- you are riht about th weihht- except most of us farmland trapers are pussys- we don't walk LOL.
Well, to be fair- the way the small farm layouts are- you can get to 99% of your locations via field roads and picked fields. In fact- my line is planned this way. In the back of my mind is how far do I want to walk in the rain- and the answer is not very far!
So waxed dirt weight isn't an issue for me- I can drive close by, and then I usually carry an ice cream bucket of dirt with me. So waxed dirt would just replace that.
I just like the thought- am pleasantly thinking about next year now- of making a set- and KNOWING you do not have to remake it because of rain or freezing conditions. If Zags every gets here, he can tell us how plweased he was with it this year- in as terrible canine trapping conditions as anyone had.
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Post by coyote on Jan 15, 2004 19:59:45 GMT -6
test.
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Post by CoonDuke on Jan 15, 2004 20:20:12 GMT -6
Steve, Did you ever try Buckwheat hulls? I use the hulls and then cover with dry or freeze proof dirt. Just a light layer. The hulls act like a "filler" so it doesn't take so much dirt per set.
Next season I am going to use waxed dirt to cover the hulls. Totally freezeproof then.
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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 15, 2004 20:50:50 GMT -6
I tried them years ago- using them almost 100% to bed traps, and didn't like them. but as filler...yes, that might work- anything to reduce the amount of dirt used. Worth trying, thats for sure.
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Post by dj88ryr on Jan 15, 2004 21:02:35 GMT -6
CD, I found a gold mine for anthill dirt on I-80, if'n ya want to sometime, we can both go up and fill our pick ups up with the stuff.
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Post by ChrisM on Jan 17, 2004 17:14:15 GMT -6
Steve,
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you but you must be getting your wax dirt cheap if you can make 200 gallons of waxed dirt for $50. I have'nt tried it, but I dont believe you can get by with 1 cup wax per gallon of dirt. Maybe it depends on your dirt? I've always used aprox 3/4 lb of wax (I think) per gallon of dirt. That figures out to over a buck per gallon of finished product. Waxed dirt is unbeatable IMO, but it does get sort of spendy if running a lot of sets.
I really like coal shale, but it must be top coated. If the top coat gets wet it will freeze a crust over the set. I used dirt and glyco for many years to top coat but now use the waxed dirt. This greatly reduces the amount of waxed dirt needed and these sets will still take a lot of weather.
As for storage of dirt and/or shale I used to have a plywood box 4 ft wide 4ft high and 8 ft long setting in an empty garage. I'd fill this heaping full and cover with a tarp. Now I have a round, 12 ft stock tank in and old grain bin that will hold a whole heaping pickup load of shale. Enough to last a good while.
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Post by Stef on Jan 17, 2004 17:29:53 GMT -6
I think you're right too Chris. 3\4 pound of flake wax per gallon of dirt is ratio I heard the most.
But recently I talked with a trapper who mixed 1 pound of wax per 1 gallon and half and he doesn't have problem at all.
I think that we can play with the ratio of wax and dirt as long as you know what you're doing and those ratio should be used on time (temperature) on your line.
Like O'Gorman said, you can bullet proof your dirt...just use more wax ;D
Stef
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Post by Steve Gappa on Jan 17, 2004 17:46:42 GMT -6
I can get the wax off the 'net for about $45 for 50lbs, plus say $12 shipping or a little more. Say $57-$58 for the wax.
I heard from several trappers that a ratio of 1 part wax to 4 parts dirt worked very well. That is 1 qt of wax to 1t. Does this differ from what you have observed? You 2 are talking that the ratio should almost be 1:1
I found one site that stated 1 cup of granulated wax equalled slightly less than 4 oz. so..multiply..carry the one..drop this...
50 lbs would be 200 cups of wax...
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Post by Stef on Jan 17, 2004 17:54:57 GMT -6
Steve, i believe that you should weight what you will buy because all granulated\flake wax are probably not the same size.
Fox Hollow suggested that ratio and i believe O'Gorman too but I'm not sure about the last.
I'll go for 1 pound wax for 1 1\2 gallon of dry dirt.
So for $50 of wax, I'll make 75 gallons of waxdirt.
Stef
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Post by ChrisM on Jan 17, 2004 18:15:46 GMT -6
Steve, are you confusing volume and weight?
I use 3/4 pound of wax per gallon of dirt. Not 1-1
Using the 1 to 4 mixture, If 50 lbs wax = 200 cups, you would have 800 cups of dirt. That might work for freezproofing, but it wouldnt = 200 gallons.
All this math is giving me a headache!
Thats a great price on wax. Care to disclose the source?
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